Q: We are buying a new place, and the top of the stairs is proving a bit tricky. That said, I don't have a staircase now, so those of you with stairs may think this one is easy. The stairs have a 1 foot wide beam at the top - just begging my three year old to walk on it (and then plummet 10 feet down the stairs). So, I guess my question is two-fold:
1. What type of gate will work here (wall to banister is 52 inches)? Will I need a carpenter to build one?
2. What can I do to make the beam/platform at the top of the stairs less appealing to my kids? Potted plants? Something besides the lights that the current owners have? Any ideas are welcome!
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Books? Could be a good place for a mini library look and would be very hard for the kiddos to climb around/past.
Easy: http://www.amazon.com/Dreambaby-L820-Retractable-Gate-White/dp/B002R2BFVM
maybe one of those spike strips they use to prevent pigeons from roosting on buildings. no... seriously... you probably only need something right at the edge like a potted plant or sculpture hard-mounted into the wood because they probably won't be able to get to the ledge from the 3rd or 4th stair down. you could always add a wrought-iron railing to make like a little balcony and fill it with plants, art, etc.
I recommend against railing. A little kid might feel challenged to climb it. Everything looks like playground equipment at a certain age.
as babies grow they get interested in anything and everything so putting anything there they can easily pull off from the stairs like books or plants is dangerous. i think it'll be best to just gate it off completely.
We use this extra wide walk-through gate at the top of our stairs. It can be mounted to the wall (recommended for the top of stairs). http://www.toysrus.com/product/index.jsp?productId=10963377
It's a no-brainer, replace your stairs with a foam pit...
What about an arrangement of tons of photos in frames? It would make it too difficult for the kiddos to walk through/around, and you'd get to see all your friends and family's smiling faces every time you walked up or down the stairs.
Dusting would be tough of course.
Like armcolor suggested I think a retractable gate at the top of the stairs is a must. I would use caution with putting anything on the ledge, it may be too much of a temptation to play with.
http://www.amazon.com/Lascal-KiddyGuard-Avant-Gate-Black/dp/B005GQ3UK0/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
Plan ahead for when you son is 6, 7, 8, 9 . . . a gate won't work because pretty soon he'll be able to climb it. And even if he's careful, the last thing you want is one of his to climb on it and fall.
Honestly, I would get a contractor in and raise the ledge up 3-4 feet all the way around. Then you could do something quite nice and decorative with maybe a row of prints leaning against the wall. Some really big black and white prints in bold black frames would look great against the yellow walls.
Wow. That's gotta be against code. What about something simple like a baby gate restricting the entire staircase. Perhaps one with a door in it. It could be placed at the bottom when the kiddo is downstairs and the top when upstairs.
I think I would frame and drywall it to the ceiling, maybe create an alcove at a higher level for decor.
This certainly can't be "to code". So dangerous. You could probably be an obnoxious buyer and try to get the seller to fix it. The builder was an idiot.
You don't remove the temptation from your kids. You CAN'T remove the temptation of balancing, scaling and climbing from your kids. If you can... I pity your kids.
I grew up in a home with a similar ledge... except it was only 4 inches wide. I would walk on it with my hands balanced on the opposite wall. And I'm still alive today!
Ledges? Please. My brother would start there, and then shimmy up the wall like a giant spider -- feet and palms against the wall until he reached the ceiling.. and he too is still alive today. (my sister is dead... but that happened when she left the house.)
Granted, yes... you will want to bar the stairwell from toddlers... but based on my childhood, you can tell your kids what you expect of them and they'll do it.
We had one of those growing up, but it was carpetted. We actually used to hang off it and try to shimmy to the other end with just hanging on by our hands!!!!!!
all in all, id say an extra wide baby gate and some stern words about how it isnt safe.
The kid is going to climb anything you put there, including a railing. So I'd make that area functional instead and just make sure that your kid isn't going to be able to get to it. The problem with putting stuff on it is really that kids might just knock that stuff off while they're trying to climb onto it.
One thing you can do is have a contractor build an extension from the platform and even if it was hollow, you could just paint it and it would look like a wall. The problem with this is really that it would make your stairway look very narrow.
I'd say get rid of it all together.Bump out the bedroom on the right and use open railing on the left to make it seem bigger. Or, completly redo your stairs and make them bigger.
A three year old should be able to understand and abide by Rule No. 1: you don't play on the stairs. Fencing it off should not be necessary unless the kid is a sleepwalker.
A child gate could become a pain to continually open and close for years on end. It only takes one time for someone to forget to close it...
Essentially the problem area is the first 2-4 feet of the ledge. I suggest placing something there, large and heavy to avoid having it knocked over, to block the point of entry of the ledge.
The right piece of furniture or even something decorative.
What about eliminating that space by using it? I'm thinking you could build some bookshelves the length of that walkway then little kiddos will not be able to walk onto the ledge because shelves (like floating shelves) are protruding into the area.
We had a similar ledge when I was growing up, only a bit narrower. My brothers and I loved to climb on it, but never did, because we would have been in deep, deep trouble for going on the ledge. It worked wonders. I say gate the whole thing when they're toddlers, but once they get a bit older, just make sure it is 100% off limits.
Now, as adults, we get in trouble when we visit for leaving keys, wallets, etc. on the ledge. Drives my mom crazy! :)
On second thought, IKEA has a cool looking shelving unit called HYLLIS. At only 10" deep and a cost of $14.99 It is inexpensive enough where you could purchase multiples and line side by side along the ledge. Anchor them to the wall so there is no chance of them being tipped over.
How about some bookshelves, affixed to the wall, all along the ledge. It would look like a library and be functional, cute and safe.
A three year old just needs you to consistently educate him/her not to climb on it. Baby-gates are for babies.
The ledge looks awkward to me - I would remove it all together.
My parents have a ledge very much like this one at their house... And my very adventurous toddler has taken years off my life over this, I'm sure! Our experience is that placing ANYTHING on the ledge did nothing to deter our son from trying to climb over/around anything we put there, and actually increased the risk of him falling.
Could you have a bookshelf built in there? If it had sides the full thickness of the ledge, and was full of books in that corner, it would give the illusion of being a wall. To the height of the light switch would be nice, and would leave room for artwork above. And (depending how far you want to take this) possibly opening the other side a bit (railing instead of wall on the left side). I can see how it would be tough to want to 'fill in' all that space, as having it open feels a bit airier.
Best of luck to you. Toddler + stairs = keeping Mom on her toes! :)
I agree with the above posters: potted plants or bookshelves.
To prevent "shimmy'ing" across the wall by holding onto that ledge..put a collection of family photos on the wall. They won't be able to shimmy without knocking all those frames over, which they wouldn't want to do in fear of getting in trouble!
Although at age 3, I would just start with the potted plants/bookshelves. I wouldn't think they would have enough upper body strength to try to monkey across the wall..yet.
This might be a terrible idea for children but I'd second the bookshelves idea. Its a rather unpleasant feature of the house so putting floating bookshelves up lining the two parts of the wall over the stairs would add a really interesting feature and a good place for storage. Most people have at least a few books they don't use very often (put those at the far end over the stairs). If you aren't much of a reader (or can't prioritize which books you will read more often than others) perhaps consider the same idea of bookshelves with display boxes (like ones from ikea - or even magazine folders). You could even store winter accessories or summer gardening things in them.
Good luck!
Ditto on having a contractor "remove" the ledge. That structure could be a temptation until the home's children attain the age of reason, which varies. I was climbing and jumping on home furnishings into elementary school. Parental threats and punishment resulted only in my continuing secretly. I stopped only after I'd experienced enough pain to accept physical laws and limitations, breaking no bones largely because my games didn't involve staircases.
We have one of those in our own house. I'm all grown up, (as is my husband) and we are finding it very useful to balance on while we open a high window. :-) I guess safety sense just doesn't grow into us at any age.
Gating it for now will probably be the way to go, and as he gets older, stern words about how it's just not safe coupled with a bunch of ice packs in the freezer will be it.
How funny, that comment brings back early memories of my mom applying first aid while saying "I told you so"!
How about using a gate on either side of the stairs that block the hall rather than a single gate at the top of the stairs?
The house I grew up in had one of these, except narrower. I think my parents took it out when they remodeled later on. A 3-year-old can get past a baby gate, right? You can tell him/her not to go out there, and explain why, but it won't work! My sister and I played on the ledge all the time. I also fell down the stairs several times as a child (and they were wood stairs- it looks like you have carpet, so you're in good shape). You can't bubble wrap babies! They'll live. Trust me, if you install bars around it or something that makes for an even better jungle gym.
It never occurred to us until my son crawled his way UP the stairs and teetered at the top... that we needed a gate at both the top *and* bottom of the stairs. Lesson learned. Now, at 4 years old, we made him promise to slide his butt down vs. walking down w/stuff in his arms. Not a hard compromise for him. :-)
We have this one for our wide stairs: http://www.retract-a-gate.com/
@Keltrue--we learned the same lesson in a similar way. And I should add that we have the gates at the top/bottom of the stairs mainly to keep the toddler on the floor where we are and/or separated from our (old, cranky) cat. At just over 2, he can easily maneuver the stairs and has been able to do so for a year. 90% of the time, we keep the gates propped open so the retractable gate would be a great idea in that instance (wish I'd known about it sooner!).
We have a very similar ledge in our house, except the ledge is only about 8 inches wide. We have no children yet (only two cats who love the ledge), but we hope to very soon and I've wondered about what to do with the ledge. It's good to see some ideas here!
We have a very similar ledge along our stairwell, which we use for our library. My husband built in bookcases specific to the space, and we put the ones we seldom need at the furthest end that is too high to reach without some kind of step stool. The only problem we have is that the kids like to pull the books off the shelves and leave them stacked on the stairs.
I used to be like many of those commenting, believing that kids should be taught safety rules rather than preventing opportunity. From an early age, we taught my oldest son how to navigate the stairs safely. Fast forward to my younger son being diagnosed with Von Willebrand Disease (a bleeding disorder similar to hemophilia), and my attitude towards safety and expectations has drastically changed. He is 2 and we still keep the baby gate up, and until he is old enough to understand the potential consequences of a fall for him (ER visit and IV infusions), we aren't allowing him to navigate stairs without direct supervision.
All of this is to say that there is no one solution or safety guideline that applies to all kids. You need to do what will work best for your individual family, not necessarily what works for others.
actually, because the ledge is not wide enough for an adult to walk on, it's still up to code to have the ledge, but that doesn't make it a good idea. It's a contractors idea to enhance the home, even though it just collects dust. from a design standpoint, your hour would lose value if you closed this off because it would make the stairwell a dark narrow passageway.
@ ANNA EUROPE you clearly don't have children, or have never been around them. Yes, a three year knows might know that it's a bad idea to climb on the ledge, but they don't have the reasoning skills to deduce why it is a bad and dangerous idea. You teach them that they shouldn't, but until you know 100% that they know it's a bad idea, you put a gate up and protect them, because god forbid something horrible happen because they have a parent like you.
Pigeon spikes. I can't believe no one suggested this yet!
@Urbancricket, See the third comment. :)
Get yourself a wooden spoon and a stern look that let's your kid know that he better not even think about playing on the stairs. Either that or have a tree in the front yard that easy to pull a switch from. That's what worked for my parents.
We had one of these growing up and my mom just kept books there.
I think hanging a floating shelf or two over the end at the top of the stairs would create a barrier while not closing in the space too much. Then you could store books or whatever you wanted on there.
LOL I was wondering how long it would take for someone to insult the opinions of another poster on the basis of them OBVIOUSLY not having children. Thanks LADESIGN, my faith in people with offspring has been restored!
I've come up with the perfect solution - have a contractor cut a big block of wood diagonally and fill in the edge of the ledge to the wall with a big wood triangle. That way, there's absolutely NOTHING for the kids to hang onto! No temptation because it would be impossible to hang onto a slope.
Even if you put books or plants there, kids will have something to hang onto. Putting in a slope means they can't even try.
I like Pi's idea. A wood triangle could be installed reversibly. It surely could be removed as a household's youngest kid approaches middle school. That would maintain the house's resale value.
I second the extra long walk through gate. We have one (not the same as mentioned above) and while it is not pretty, it is perfect. If you are going to be putting a gate at the top of the stairs, definately do NOT use one of the pressure mounted gate. If baby puts enough weight on it, which they eventually will, there is the chance the gate could come loose and it and the baby will careen down the stairs. There is a chance your child may not even be interested in it at all, or if you have a kid like mine, all obsticles present as challanges. Good luck.
I didn't read the entire thread, but I agree with Pinetree -- raise the ledge. Your three year old is at the point when they can handle the stairs, even if they're not used to it now, they will be soon. The raised ledge will discourage the balance beam temptation now and in future.
Think beyond "baby gate." There are some very adaptable dog gates made for wide and difficult-to-span openings. They can be purchased in furniture-grade wood finishes, and the better ones are designed to hold up to dogs far larger than your children. (I don't want to plug a specific catalog here.) I think the only safe fix for the ledge is to gate it off for now.
A future solution for the beam might be a shallow, custom planter box filled with rocks, sculptural branches or some other vertical interest, and up lights.
Foam pit +1... If your kid is a daredevil, your kid is a daredevil.
All joking and aesthetics aside, you could always build a custome retractable railing that actually collapses into the half wall on the left. That way when you don't need to have the railing set up it collapses with minimal visibility into the half wall, provides you with a custom solution that fits your needs and most importantly provides protection for your child(ren).
Another vote for bookshelves up to the light switch! I'd get a nice set of custom ones made.
Gates aren't practical for long term use. And as someone else has mentioned, you'd need two sets.
From my own experience with kids (being one, having crazy siblings, and now 2 of my own), just about any structure you put there may entice climbing (depending on the child, of course). Kids are all different. With my daughter "Don't touch" sufficed, but my son - he would be tightrope walking on that thing as soon as our backs are turned, and you just don't need that stress.
So I think you may need to assess the risk-taking behavior level of your child first off.
Then you need to consider the aesthetics and costs.
It looks like removing it entirely could be very costly. So if that is not an option, and you consider your child high-risk for the climbing on it part, I would do something to make it totally inaccessible, and I think more than just a triangle to block it (because they might still be tempted to go around that) - I think it would need to be a slope all the way along that side wall right (I would paint it all white, to make it as invisible as possible), or raising it all the way along (but I think the slope is the safer option of the two).
Oh, another idea...you could put a "false wall" in there, but you will have to re-set the light switch into that. That is, leave the existing wall as is, and build the false wall over it, with it firmly secured and your light switch set into the false wall.
If you sell, you could remove it and have a few screw holes to fill, some paintwork to fix and the light switch wired back to what it was. I'm guessing that could still get expensive if you don't have the skills to DIY, especially messing with the electrical part.
First, let me offer the guess that the ledge is because the wall, possibly a fire wall from a garage, projects into the space and the ledge covers it up. Meaning, if true, it can't be removed.
I was thinking about making the space pretty. You could install a wall of tree trunks (sampling sized birch trees would be my choice) from the ledge to the ceiling like a mini forest. You could paint the wall behind a pale sky blue, do a full mural, use birch wallpaper, or just leave it the color it is -- each would give a different character to the space. Cluster maybe three trees in a close configuration at the head of the stairs, them space them a little more randomly for a woodland feel.
Might also look s cool with bamboo, for a more zen feel.
@LADesign,
I have a 5 year old who's perfectly comfortable and trustworthy around stairs. He's been taught how to walk on stairs, and he knows not to play on them... really, it's not some kind of rocket surgery you can't do without parental superpowers
@OP,
If you keep the stairwell as-is, perhaps you can put some nasty, stingy plants on the ledge to de-tempt your kiddos from playing on it.
I agree with the bookshelf idea. Windowbox planters may also be good, as they'll take up the width and discourage climbing more effectively than traditional standalone ceramic pots. Raise them up a foot or so, and it'll be even less tempting. Just don't plant shiny/pretty flowers, as they may be more tempting. Herbs or ivy would be good.
I vote for installing some floor to ceiling bookshelves there. It would do away with the walkable space there and also be a useful storage location. If climbing the shelves is an issue you could always put doors over the bottom portion of them.
Who says the ledge has to be flat and horizontal? One could install an "anti-shelf" at a 45-degree or greater angle, which would keep the space above open, transition from the narrowness below, and prevent any objects (animate or in-) from gathering on the ledge.
If it were my home, I would use a secure but reversible installation method, to permit the ledge to return to duty as a display shelf in the future, after the child has acquired a fear of fall-down-and-go-boom.
Ah, Pi already made the same suggestion before I did ... The appproach definitely works in museums, schools, and other public spaces.
I would put books along the ledge, personally. Or install a railing along the ledge and use the narrow space in between for some tall, narrow display. My grandparents house had a skinny area along the side of the stairs and then a small open area at the back of them, all with a big metal railing. As kids, we all thought it was a fabulous place for a fort/reading nook. I think they had more room to work with though.
We used a retractable gate for a similarly narrow top of a staircase at our apartment. Like this: http://www.amazon.com/Dreambaby-L820-Retractable-Gate-White/dp/B002R2BFVM It worked very well for us. At the bottom, I gated off the hallway instead of the bottom of the staircase, which had the advantage of keeping the small one from messing with the heavy outside door and the staircase both. Depending on what's on that floor, you could gate off a section of the hall rather than just the staircase.
I'd get some cheap Billy bookcases to fill up the space although securing them to the wall and filling them would be a pain.
That comment reminds me of how risky points on escalators are made safer by covering them with clear acrylic panels. The panels are screwed into the walls, although I'm not sure how that would be done in this stairway. Acrylic would be less darkening and visually crowding than some other options.
Whatever you decide to do (bookshelves, stern lectures, gates...all of the above) you might want to add in one more idea that leans toward silly. Put a gnome or an elf (a la elf on a shelf) on the ledge and make up a story for your toddler about how the elf is there to watch and make sure nobody climbs on his ledge and that he's a really terrible tattle tale. Have the elf sitting there right when you move in. It might just inspire your toddler when temptation strikes as we know it will :)
Oh, and if elves and gnomes are a little to scary (though I think that adds to the overall effect) or clash with your decor, you could always do an elephant sculpture or something...
Clever, sort of like Santa Claus! By the time a child is old enough to recognize that elf as make-believe, he should have developed enough safety sense to resist the temptation of the ledge.
You could fall-proof the kids with a helmet and kneepads every morning instead!
I would only feel safe blocking this off with a secure barrier until the kids are plenty old enough... and in my personal experience, putting any stuff on anything just makes it more attractive to get into (and more precarious).
I'm all for teaching toddlers "no," but some situations are too risky to trust to discipline, and you could go bonkers having to constantly supervise. We moved into a house with a slightly funky staircase, and it took us about 2 months to get around custom-building some baby gates. Once we did, life was 100 times more manageable.
I agree with previous posters who have suggested raising the ledge 4 or 5 feet from where it is presently; either a rectangle or a sloped shape as this addition would be the most economical. I would not put in a bookcase as you will have a real battle getting the books in and out nor would I put a plant stand of any type there as you would also be challenged watering the plants and there doesn't appear to be sufficient light for them to grow properly.
Silly ledge...I can see why you are stumped. My comment is more to do with protecting your little one from falling down the stairs. I'm surprised that so many people seem to think you are being too protective. That is a lot of stairs! That could seriously injure anyone, never mind a tiny person who can so easily lose their footing. My brother and I were at least 7 before we started tobogganing down ours on our crazy carpets! S/he will have to line the wall/door with couch cushions and pillows for a softer landing...
Good luck, I hope you find an easy solution!
Make the stairs a slide. fun for the whole family.
As someone who used to terrorize my mother by climbing on anything and everything (My first memory is thinking my mother was distracted enough by her soaps and climbing an exercise machine. Then finding out she was not distracted enough.) I second the idea of a bookshelf but you're going to have to make sure there are no hand holds or ledges they can climb around or use as foot holds. This probably means blanking out the right-most edge of the shelves with a plank of wood. .. Depending on how dedicated a climber your child is.
What about something more simple like building a bookcase at the top of the staircase where there is an opening to the ledge. It would be easy storage for you and wouldn't look as much like a walk around for the kids. If it is blocked there (at least for now) they won't be interested in getting over there. And then you can gate it from the bookcase to the opposite wall.
I'd get a carpenter to build a gate and somehow block the ledge.
Glass railing type enclosure or as earlier said frame it up and drywall. FYI if you or hubby can do a simple frame up rough the drywall on. just contract the finishing out, (it's a pain) that shouldn't be too much $$$
My sister has a retractable gate but she covered it with her own fabric.
the easiest baby proof method is to avoid having babies in the first place. i've always chosen swanky living spaces over babies.