apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

That photo makes me think of the movie 'The Birds' except with more frighteningly ugly jackets..

It's one of those weird class things. Like it used to be poor people who were skinny and only the rich could afford to get fat. Now the poor can only afford foods packed with high fructose corn syrup and the rich pay for gym memberships. (Massive generalization; but you get the point)

So it used to be that poor people hung their clothes (or other people's clothes when poor women's employment often meant taking in laundry) on clotheslines and once washing machines and dryers were available, only the rich could afford them. But I don't see clotheslines in poor neighborhoods anymore. I think the working poor work too many jobs and just use laundromats. So within a few years, I think cultural attitudes towards clotheslines will adjust and people will be more comfortable with it in wealthy neighborhoods.

I answered no to the backyard thing as it strikes me as a little "Green Acres" but what is wrong with hanging things indoors? I hang most clothes that I wash overnight inside (door jambs make great places to hang things). Towels, I hang over the shower door. Sheets are one of the few things I dry due to size and they are dry in a heartbeat. You can still avoid the dryer without irritating your neighbors!

I love old pictures of Manhattan with clothes lines hanging over the street between the buildings. Here's a cool photo by Jacob Riis called 'Bandit's roost'

http://www.historycooperative.org/journals/cp/vox-pop/images/gny3.jpg

Cool illustration--Kaarina's as good at Photoshopping laundry as the Iranians are at missiles. . . .

If you have a family of any size, there are rarely enough places inside the home to hang everything.

My mom hung laundry on the line in the yard throughout my childhood and teen years. So did everyone we knew.
She's bordering on elderly now so I think she gets a pass on creating more work for herself.

It makes the most sense to hang laundry in the yard. Provided you bother to take it down at the end of the day.

The fact that this is even a question that needs to be asked is just baffling to me. I know that there are communities that put bans on things like this (I grew up in one), but I don't understand how any rational-minded person could object to line-drying laundry because of perceived damage to property value or diminished views.

It's a disgusting argument, really. Classism to the extreme; total arrogance and self-importance. I'm not criticizing AT for raising the question, but sad that it even needs to be discussed (and that, at present, there are 8 votes against line-drying).

But then again, I'm the type of person who also likes sidewalks and front porches, and thinks seeing your neighbors is a GOOD thing.

It's just one more thing I'm not allowed to do on my apartment deck. But I hope lurker2209 is right and that this shifts.

While I do hang some things in the house, there's not enough room for this (I have a drying rack and several door knobs). If I had some proper indoor space, that would help. For instance, if it were possible to stretch a clothesline across the bathroom (where I don't have to worry about the carpet getting dripped on), that would be great. A little hotel in Germany had that very thing built into it: the line came out of one wall and attached to a hook on the opposite side. A great idea.

We always line dried clothes all summer when I was a kid. Living in Fresno, CA, with 100 degree weather and less than 10% humidity, usually the first half of the load was dry by the time you'd finished hanging the whole thing, and you could just take it straight down. Winters meant drying on racks in the house over the heat register, until my uncle bought my mother a dryer for Christmas one year. She still hangs everything in the summer though.

I think there's no problem with hanging clothes out as long as you don't leave them up for ages (ugly, and your clothes fade). I don't have a yard, but have been considering hanging my stuff inside, as my apartment's dryer is super crappy, and it feels so wasteful to have to run it twice even for tiny loads.

Also, I agree with Anna that it's sad we have to discuss the "property value" aspect.

i was just talking to my sister about this yesterday, she said she's putting up a line in the backyard after living in her house for a year. when you're trying to do all the family laundry in a day, it's so much faster. sheets and towels can go on the line, leaving the dryer free for smaller loads. cuts a couple of hours off washday.

I'm all for it. I don't do it outside, but I do inside, and as soon as I get a proper sized laundry room, I'm getting one of these: http://www.amazon.com/Whitney-Design-Telescoping-Indoor-Drying/dp/B0000CNQX2

I always found it beautiful... In Montréal, I think it's part of the urban landscape and our cultural heritage. We hang our laundry in the back alleys though, not over the street from frontage to frontage...

It always baffled me that people are against hanging clothes outdoors. I agree with Anna about the snootiness of those who don't like it.
Nothing better than fresh dried sheets from an outside clothes line :)

in fact, we remembered our old neighbor next door, used to call my mom country 'cause we were from tennessee and hung clothes on the line, as she wouldn't do such a thing in our new suburban development.........for two years she dried her clothes at another neighbor's house rather than hang a line because she couldn't afford her own. freeloader!!

I never had any idea that line drying was such an issue until I moved to the city. Even now, some landlords ban people from drying clothes on their balconies. I dry mine indoor because I live in an apartment. It's cheaper and better for my clothes.

I think there should be by-laws against line drying bans, personally.

I only mind my gypsy basement neighbours doing it in the backyard because their clothesline is a droopy extension cord & they wash their children's clothes in a bucket outside my kitchen window. Their stuff is strewn all over the backyard rendering it unusable for everyone else.

Otherwise it's a good idea!

Oh, as an addendum, my roommate and I got an official written warning in college for 2 blouses hung from hangers on our balcony for approximately 3 hours in the middle of the day. It was insane.

Clothes lines just make sense. I can't believe people are so stuck up they'll complain about clothes hanging to dry. Come on, it's not the end of the world.
There are more important things to worry about than your neighbours undies hanging out to dry.
Priorities, people!

i think the above drying photo looks like a neat, funky art installation.

And you know what, living in a neighbourhood where people hang clothes on the line lets you know that your neighbours are around and active. I hate living in areas where everyone shuts their door and pulls the curtains shut to the world.

I think it's silly that anyone would be offended by someone drying their clothes outside, as long as the clothes are taken down within a reasonable period of time.

That said, I have an asthmatic child and cats, so I could never do this, even if I had the space. My son's clothes would be full of pollutants and pollen spores from hanging wet outside and I'm pretty sure that our clothes would end up containing more cat hair than fabric.

It's unreal how much cat hair I get out of the dryer filter. I wish I could find a way to weave it into cloth and sell it...

Joss,

You might find a retractable line at the hardware store. I know Lillian Vernon used to have them in their little catalogue.
It's a round, stainless steel dome with a line that pulls out of it - sounds like what you described.

I put a second shower curtain rod (tension rod)above my tub to hang clothes to dry from hangers. It was intended to be temporary - take it down and put it up as needed - but it's been there ever since I moved in.

CarolynApplebee,
You're right - I'd forgotten that using the outdoor clothes line gets everything done faster... multiple loads in one day.
Come to think of it... that may be why my sis-in-law can never seem to finish laundry for her family of 5 - even though my mom managed it for the same size family.

also, I remember the fun of running under and through the sheets hanging on the line in the crisp summer sun when I was little.
I recently saw a detergent ad that portrayed this and sort of chuckled to myself thinking it was probably against most ordainances these days!!

Joss, Target sells retractable clotheslines. I don't know if they have ones that can be mounted in the shower but there must be some place out there that sells them.

I line dry my clothes in the summer (which in Sacramento equates to about six months). I love the smell of the clothing.

Two great line drying websites:

* the BBC website has tips on maximising the efficacy of your line drying habit; http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/alabaster/A592625

* artist Gretchen Markle has a number of oil paintings on the theme of "Cumberland Clotheslines"; http://gretchenmarkle.com/gallery/cumberland_clotheslines_1/

I was thrilled when we found two old laundry poles at a salvage store and installed them in the (far) backyard. That and the greywater washing machine make me unreasonably happy.

But I agree about the class comment--to some, drying on the line is a step backward. I imagine in some countries, choosing to eat mostly vegetables when you can afford meat is another strange choice.

Talk about cultural differences...

I was really irritated reading a post about line drying as if it were a new trend and then finding that the discussion was about it affecting property values. That's a thought I would have never come up with.

Here in Germany it's absolutely normal to line dry your clothes indoors or out.
In fact I just got a dryer this winter because I hate drying my clothes in the bedroom when it's too cold outside and everyone who sees it comments about how fancy we are to have a dryer now. ;o)

Also I have never heard about someone who wasn't allowed to dry their clothes on their balcony.

It's really interesting to see the different views on things around the world!

We always used a clothes line in FL (until a hurricane wiped it out a couple of years ago). When I lived in the Czech Republic last year, clothes dryers are relatively rare so I hung my clothes to dry in my apt or on my balcony (like everyone else). The true adventure was drying sheets on a rack but other than that, it wasn't a problem. Line drying is better for the environment, your electricity bill and your clothes (color stays brighter, whites stay white).

It is a "funky" art installation by the Finnish artisit Kaarina Kaikkonen. This one was done in downtown Helsinki a few years ago, but she has done many others as well. Look her up!!!

I have a backyard with 9 foot fig covered walls and a big melaluca tree and fruit trees growing on the backside of my neighbors yard so I have my own little oasis I can line dry in and no one knows the difference.

Yes, the link above takes you to many more of her amazing installation pieces. I love them!

"But I agree about the class comment--to some, drying on the line is a step backward."

I have to agree. But the concept always makes me wonder about flip-flops. I think flip-flops as daily shoes is insane (you open toes are very close to some nasty stuff in my area). And it they can't be comfortable when it rains.

Whenever I see flip-flops off the beach I think of photos of third world children. It seems like a major step back to me, but without any obvious benefits.

I think the poll is really what is making this about property values, not the answerers. I don't really want to see my neighbors clothes hung up all over the place, but it has nothing to do with property values. It has to do with aesthetics and the fact that there are many ways to avoid using your dry that do not involve me having to look at your stuff. More power to you if youwant hang your undies out to dry and I don't have to stare at them.

I always line dry my clothes during the summer. We have a covered porch and I just run bungee cords between the supports for instant clotheslines. It's a green practice that saves us money. Otherwise, the dryer would run all day because we're a family of five with a teenage girl.

Honestly, if my neighbors don't like it, then that's their problem. I don't live in a covenant controlled community (anymore).

I would like to throw back this question to the readers- Do you want this in your backyard? Don't forget we're not talking about gucci clothes here. can you bear to see your neighbor's underwear, undershirts, etc.

I'm with Anna - I can't imagine being offended by the sight of drying clothes. Actually, I think clotheslines can be quite beautiful.

If the neighbor is comfortable putting it out there, why do I mind seeing it? (And really, if it's in their back yard, why am I looking anyway? Maybe I need binoculars so I can get a really good look and be deeply troubled. Right now, I'm stuck being offended at their underwear in the laundry room.)

I don't line dry, I don't have the space for it. But when I have had items line dried in the past, they were rather more uncomfortable than dryer dried clothes. Any way around that?

Sure, if you have a backyard or a back alley, I don't care. But I don't think people should string lines across main streets. What if a clothespin fell on someone? If it's only 2 stories high, maybe it's no big deal, but from 12 or 22 stories? Not a good idea.

We just moved and have yet to hook up our dryer because we need to have a 220 line run to the laundry room to accommodate our electric dryer. Luckily, I have this:
http://www.amazon.com/Whitney-Design-15-7-Outdoor-Retractable/dp/B0000BYDEA/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=home-garden&qid=1216236717&sr=1-6

I'm in Southern Colorado where it's HOT and DRY right now, and I can hang about 3 loads on this and be done drying in about the same amount of time it would take to do one load in the dryer.

Plus everything smells SO FRESH when it comes off the line.

Regarding drying indoors, if you live in a humid climate it fosters molds and mildews and can be pretty harmful health-wise. Here we don't really have that problem, but in the east or west parts of the country they do (maybe not southern CA).

can you bear to see your neighbor's underwear, undershirts, etc.

I don't spend a lot of time peering into my neighbors' yards, but no, when I happen to glance at line drying clothes, it's doesn't bother me in the slightest. I suppose I might get annoyed if they left loads hanging for several days, but since that's bad for the clothes anyway, it's not as likely.

Growing up, my mother always line dried our clothes (she always said that it's gentler on the fabric and makes them last longer) and now it's my habit, too. I lived in England for a while and everyone seemed to line dry their clothes, usually with drying racks placed indoors. Using a dryer is such an 'American' thing to all my English friends.

a little tangent, but on the energy efficient note, folks that aren't line drying should clean their dryer vent at least once a year.

I had no idea, and am horrified by how many times i ran the dryer in my old house 1 1/2 cycles, sometimes 2 cycles to dry. We never cleaned the vent in the wall, just the louvered flap outside.

While on an appliance parts website, I saw an article about dryer fires, and why you should clean your vent annually. I peeked up my vent with a mirror, and gawd, I don't think it's been clean since 1978, I'm so glad we haven't hooked anything up yet.

Anyhow, I ordered this yesterday, I can't vouch for the seller yet, but the product is getting great reviews.

http://www.amazon.com/GARDUS-RLE202-10PC-Vent-System/dp/B000T4TV7K/ref=pd_bbs_1?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1216243634&sr=8-1

here's their home site, they don't sell direct, but it has better pictures
http://www.linteater.com/

I dry my stuff indoors on two free-standing racks, not for fear of offending the neighbors but because I don't want it to get bugs & bird doo! (I have experience in these matters).

I live in a fairly humid area of the country and it works overnight. And I am saving about $10/mo electricity.

I had a neighbor complain about this just the other month. I can't believe people mind, but I guess they do - line drying is an eyesore??? I guess? I don't know. We always line-dried when I was a kid. It was never a problem when I lived in Wisconsin. But here in supposedly eco-friendly San Francisco? I am ordered to take it down.

Maybe it is a class thing (we live in a pretty swank neighborhood in SF), but I'm still missing it. Why is drying clothes outside offensive? You see the clothes on people, but seeing them disembodied (literally, haha) is weird or off-putting? Huh?

Dryers gobble electricity, and as such line drying should be right at the core of every "green" home. Frankly, if you claim to be attempting to "go green" in any way, and yet own a dryer, you are a hypocrite of Ted Haggardian proportions.

This topic has come up a number of times on this site recently.

That said, I'm all for line drying. I don't think I'd want to live in the kind of neighborhood where people would have a problem with it, either.

I was stunned that anyone would choose not to line dry for fear of offending the neighbors. If your neighbors are that shallow and disinterested in saving energy, then that is their problem.

Also, can anyone force you to take down your clothes? Are their neighborhoods that prohibit it? That'd really be an indication of something being very wrong in America if that were the case.

Everyone (and I mean everyone) dries their clothes on lines in Tokyo and no one lives closer together than Tokyoites.

@Orchid64: Yes, there are neighborhoods here in the U.S. that do prohibit it, and yes, it's pathological that this is the case.

That said, whenever I've tried to line-dry my clothing, they've come out stiff and smelling a little funny (and not in a good way), whether outdoors or in. And indoors, the house feels dank (if it's cold) or humid (if its hot) during and after drying. But when I dry them in a dryer, they come out soft and smelling fresh.

If I currently had a place outside to dry them, that would solve the dank-or-humid-house problem, but past experience has shown it does not help the dank-smelling-and-stiff-clothing problem.

So as much as I love the idea of line-drying clothing, I've found it's only really practical for synthetics-- which dry quickly, don't start smelling mouldy before they do dry, don't seem to get as stiff from line-drying, and don't absorb pollutants the way natural fabrics do. But since I try to use natural fabrics, that becomes a catch-22.

I guess it's different for people in dry climates-- the idea of the first items hung being dry by the time you get to the bottom of the basket has NOT been my experience in the least.

But why on earth would I (or anyone else) be offended at seeing someones laundry drying in their yard/on their porch, if they have one or the other? I don't get what the issue is.

So sorry, @Blandwagon, you're a better person than I am if you can deal with the musty-dank-humid-stiff-slightly-smelly factor and refrain from ever using a dryer. Or perhaps you live in a climate where this isn't an issue?

Frankly, if you claim to be attempting to "go green" in any way, and yet own a dryer, you are a hypocrite of Ted Haggardian proportions.....posted by Blandwagon


Blandwagon, it's that kind of judgment and distain for folks who are attempting to be green in their lives (but clearly not living up to your high standards) that make the average person give up trying anything at all. Why bother trying if you are damned by eco-fanatics if you do and damned if you don't?

This seems so ridiculous to me! In England everyone dries their clothes outside. Some people do have a tumble dryer but only really use them when the weather is bad. We've never owned a dryer...and that isn't to say we *couldn't*. It seems extremely snobby to not like seeing another neighbour's laundry. I never even notice when mine are drying their clothes.

However, my mum has a rule that we can never put her underwear on the line! Hehe

This is really an american cultural issue. I grew up an hour from Chicago and we never had issues hanging everything on the line (except the winters, obviously, when things freeze!)

As an adult, I've lived in Spain, where everyone line dries everything, and now in England, where tumble dryers are still somewhat a luxury. It's really normal for people to hang their clothes out to dry here and it'd be totally, utterly absurd to enact a law that prevented people from doing it, as so many cookie-cutter communities have done back home.

Seriously, people just need to get over it.

"Why bother trying if you are damned by eco-fanatics if you do and damned if you don't?"

Because it's not a game of public approval. Just like anything else in your life, why do you care what others think? It's strange how people are going green only because of peer pressure and not from any desire to do so for themselves.

It's interesting, I grew up in one of the nicer suburbs in Vancouver and every house came with the stand-alone laundry dryer (think of an upside-down patio umbrella sans fabric) in the backyard.
Where I live now (East Van) almost everyone uses their laundry line. I use mine almost every time I do laundry and as others have said, it really cuts down on laundry time.
I hate the winter when I can't use it. I have an indoor drying rack but that only holds so much.

Monkeyme, I was not expressing my personal opinion with that statement, but trying to point out that if we are hyper-critical of people who have begun to make positive changes in their lives to live a less wastefully by chastizing them for the major changes they have not yet made, then the chances of discouraging them are quite high. Not because of a lack of public approval but because they may get the impression that small changes don't help and you are only aiding the environment by living in a hut with no electricity.

There are a thousand other things I would like to see every average family doing to live more efficiently before I'd expect them to give up something like a clothes dryer when they are such an ingrained part of our way of life here.

I can't help but wonder if Blandwagon has a car. If so, it's a bit ironic-- since commuting to work by car every day would have a hekuva lot more of a negative impact on the enviornment than I am by running my dryer once a week, and I've been car-free for years now, and loving it.

But I'm NOT going to claim that anyone who claims to be trying to be green and yet owns a motorized vehical for any reason is a "hypocrite of Ted Haggardian proportions", just because I'm able to thrive without one. (Who is this Ted person we're referring to, anyway?)

I love the way the Brits call it a "tumble dryer" So cute!

I lived in rural Wales for a year and in London also. In Wales we hung laundry in the courtyard of my friends' house. In London on a rack inside or occasionally in the garden. It takes a LONG time to dry clothes in that climate, but we just didn't wash as much.

Americans (and I am one)--we're clean freaks now! It wasn't always so. When i was a kid we took baths a couple of times a week and my mom (on the air force base) always line dried the clothes on one of those free standing dryers with plastic line. When he hung out the sheets it was time to play camping!