apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

They come from countries that don't use creosote to preserve their railroad ties; see this thread for a discussion of their safety and green-ness:

http://sanfrancisco.apartmenttherapy.com/sf/green-ideas/railroad-tie-dining-table-and-chairs-from-vivaterra-031664

And I wish whoever had that discussion with them would recall what countries those might be and what was used to treat the wood instead... there's no way that the wood wasn't treated with something, and creosote has been the international norm for-like-ever.

These porducts are actually not even remotely environmentally friendly or safe.
They are mostly made in China and India (who are responsible for a large percentage of the worlds pollution).
They also use so much packaging (plastic, paper, bubble-wrap) and fossil fuels transporting, that no one should buy this stuff if they are trying to be environmentally responsible.
Shop locally, LA has an incredible amount of resources that arent exploiting a "trend" or damaging to the environment.

Since Viva Terra hasn't yet answered my email to them, I did some digging. Their railroad tie furniture is supposed to be teak, pine, and ironwood. None of these are naturally rot-resistant woods, so in any climate with non-desert humidity, they'd need treatment with preservatives if they aren't to rot.

Teak was used for railroad ties in South Africa and in northern India. Ironwood is native to South America, Africa, and India, so again, you're looking at tropical weather. Bear in mind that these aren't places where there was some quaint, non-toxic local wood preserver. Extension of railroads was part of modernization/Westernization, using the cheapest materials likely to be effective. (And that would ordinarily have been creosote.)

I'm having trouble finding a country where pine was commonly used, which is unsurprising, since it's a softwood, and railroad ties are ordinarily hardwoods.

Possible preservatives other than creosote are:

--Chromated copper arsenate, invented in the 1930s and spottable by the greenish tint of the wood. Australia has banned CCA in uses where children are in contact with it.

--Pentachlorophenol (PCP), widely used for railroad ties. NASTY stuff, though you'd probably have to chew on the furniture to get significant exposure.

Every other alternative is newer and unlikely to show up in recycled ties. So "wood that wasn't preserved with creosote" is most likely wood preserved with PCP.

I'm not doubting the sincerity of the Viva Terra people in believing they're providing environmentally friendly products -- I'm just wondering if they actually know where the ties come from and what their past life was.

by law, they have to disclose the country of origin of the product. That may not tell you where the wood is from, but at least you'll know where it was assembled. Its most likely India.

wende, good luck getting a response from your emails. I emailed them at least a dozen times about something else and finally had to make a phone call.

I wonder if the creosote is something that dissipates over time. Is that possible? I really have no idea.

I am a merchant from VivaTerra and wanted to share with you our findings on this collection. (sorry for the long post!)

Like many of you, we were attracted to the clean lines and rustic chic of these pieces, and we loved that they reuse a precious resource; hardwood. Our ties are from colonial era India and as noted they are usually ironwood or teak that has degraded to the point of being unusable as a tie. They are either being replaced by concrete, plastic or wooden ties, or not replaced as railroad is no longer in use.

According to an advisor at the Railroad Tie Association the history of treating wood ties in the US did not begin in earnest until the early part of the 20th century. Then even after that it took several decades for them all to be treated. Since the US was the most industrial nation during this time period we have been told that it is extremely unlikely that creosote (a by-product of the coal coking process used for steel making) would have been used to any extent in India to treat ties. With the vast amount of naturally durable wood species like ironwood and teak available locally and throughout the British Empire we believe that it is highly improbable that anyone would have spent the money to use a wood preservative. Nevertheless, we have been investigating testing options for the wood.

In regards to packaging concerns, the pieces use the same amount of packaging whether you buy them from a local store or a catalog. We belive that catalog shopping can be a more efficient route for buying goods - the efficiency of consolidated shipments (to our warehouse and direct to the customer) eliminates the middle step in non-catalog shopping: shipping to stores and driving to stores by customers.

And lastly, thank you to all our fans on this site - it's great to read the feedback and to feel the appreciation for the collection we've put together. Eco-living has never been a trend for us. We mailed our first catalog in 2004 and everyone here has been passionate about sustainable design well before it was trendy.

OK, that's all I've got! I appologize for any delays and frustration with customer service. We are continually trying to upgrade our servive. Thanks, and happy home making...
p.s. the chairs really are comfortable!