apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

I still can't understand how you can spend money on Anne Sacks tiles, Dornbracht hardware, Henrybuilt, for a place you RENT?!!! This is the luckiest landlord in the world - are you under rent control or something? Still, how can you throw that much money away - I just renovated my place, so I understand that you live with it, so you have to love it, but that much money?

Maxwell, I hope you will not be offended but I completely agree with sassyMD. I also think that all this work in a rental (very high end stuff I might add) is in direct contradiction to your recent post on 'simple living' and 'living with what you have and making it work.'

There's nothing you can do about it now, but your expensive kitchen won't be ready until almost a month after the baby comes - how are you going to live? I just think you have no idea what is coming your way. Some of us who are parents here have darkly predicted that you may be in for the surprise of your life and if you think you can live without a kitchen (in the middle of a construction site) with a newborn you better have a concrete plan B. I'm starting to get a little worried here...

Maxwell -
I love you to death, I love your site to death, I love your book to death, I love your philosophy to death - BUT - I think you're nuts!!!

*holds head in hands*

*moans*

This project is now two months behind, according to the earlier 9-Month Cure postings. That's over 20% slippage on schedule. Back when I worked at an engineering firm, we would have been extremely concerned about this much variance, as it's usually a sign that more problems will follow.

You would be extremely wise to start making plans to have S-K stay somewhere else around the time she's actually due to produce the baby. If half your space is given over to construction, that puts her, you, and baby in a 100-sq-ft space. That's smaller than most hotel rooms outside NYC.

And you're going to have intermittent water shut-offs to install the plumbing bits of the new kitchen, which I promise is NOT desirable with a little one. S-K can always to choose to rough it if that's really what she wants to do, but you'll never regret having an option available for her if the birth is more stressful than she expects. Even young, healthy mothers do sometimes have a hard time with the last month, with labor, with breast-feeding -- you just can't count on the whole thing being as simple as squatting in the fields, giving birth, and then tucking Baby in a sling and going on with the harvest.

I vote for the "Camogli" chair ;)

One other thing (sorry to be so negative) - right before a baby is not the time to be spending lots of money. Babies and children cost A LOT. I hope you have considered this.

this is your blog right? I hope you're at least getting a 'discount.'

Oh, I've got one more thing, too.

Maxwell, your current situation would make many non-pregnant women tense and crabby. You're counting on a woman in the late stages of pregnancy -- raging hormones, easily tired, baby pressing on bladder, possibly trouble sleeping, possibly swollen feet and hands, general feeling of toting a Volkswagon Bug on one's front -- to be more easy-going and relaxed than the typical woman.

You're counting on a woman who has just given birth -- long labors are typical for first babies, so we're talking MAJOR pain and exhaustion, and that's if one doesn't end up with a Caesarian, which is SURGERY -- to be more easy-going and relaxed than the typical woman.

You're counting on a newborn to sleep through construction havoc and to let you two get enough sleep to allow you to deal with construction havoc without starting to shriek yourselves.

Maybe S-K meets this profile. (If so, nominate her for sainthood now.) Maybe Baby will meet this profile. But it's a long, long, looooooong way off the norm of most people's experiences.

Okay, that's enough of me sounding like someone's mother-in-law.

Love the Standard chair but let me just say, not so comfortable.

As a birth support person, I can say unequivocally that a woman can make due with whatever she wants to make due with during the time surrounding birth.
Alternative options are good, but women (and parents in general) have been making due with what they've got for a long, long time.
I applaud you two and wish all of you well.

I'd love to be a contrary voice on this, to say, "These people worry too much. It will be fine. Just roll with it." But I can't. The advice above, particularly wende's suggestion of an alternate living location for the crucial months (last month of pregnancy, first month of the baby), is really thoughtful and sound. Pregnancy and childbirth can often, and I mean OFTEN, be overthought. Endless ruminations feed a book industry, a gear industry, and instill misplaced panic where it generally isn't necessary. That said, the nest, the cave (small, simple, and lovely if that's what feeds the soul) is essential. It doesn't take much. I'm actually of the mind that the apartment can work for the three of you for a while. But having the vital infrastructure in place (or finding a location where it will be) so that your attention can be focused elsewhere, I think that's going to be vital to your enjoyment of this amazing time of transition.

To join the clucking hens, I just can't imagine any post-birth mother wanting to sit in any of the chairs you have pictured. Ouch!

Camogli.

Aim for a perfect execution of Plan A. But, also create a Plan B that is as good, if not better, than Plan A, to lessen any “consternation” that might be happening. The truth is that you will want to spend as much time together as a family (in quiet peace) when the baby comes home. And while a redesign is important and necessary, nothing will be more important than the baby, mom and dad.

I can only wish you well and I hope all goes as planned, Maxwell! Post-pardum is torture but if anyone can sail through it without meds, you and SK can.
Best of luck!

maria

I like the Camogli best.

But, as someone who has recently babysat a 4-week old, I can't imagine feeding a baby while sitting in one of these chairs.

I share many of the concerns expressed above but I'm sure you both will figure out how to make it work and laugh about the foibles of it all at some point, too!

why, pray tell, all this ultra-high end improvement in your teeny tiny rental? how does this fit into your living simple ethos? i'm curious. i mean, there are many other faucet choices beyond the $$$$ Dornbracht - and shopping at Ann Sacks and Troy, well, it doesn't get more pricey than that, does it? it's really none of my business and i wish you well, but i, too, am curious as to how this fits into the philosophy that you've been espousing on this blog. thanks in advance for being so open about this.

p.s. the cherner chair will probably take up the least amount of space. it's my favorite.

Maxwell and SK have to be able to write off all this stuff. Or they get sick discounts. Or both. Very savvy people, our hosts here at AT.

One more vote for Camogli.

p.s. i have to agree with people here -- none of those chairs are comfortable enough for post-partum life, beautiful and as chic as they may be.

I'm also confused by the renovating-a-rental concept. Why? How? With what ultimate benefit in mind? Is this a NYC thing? I honestly have never really heard of it.

(I've lived in Boston and Chicago too and never knew anyone that did it there either....but just b/c I'm not familiar w/it doesn't mean it's not common in some circles....can someone please just tell me what those circles are? :) )

I suppose it's time for me to chime in. Guys, we've already embarked on this project and we need your support - sure, parts of it are crazy, but we've make the decision to stay in our little apartment for now so the goal is to make it as comfortable as possible.

To address some of the naysayers' points:

COST: The Ann Sacks tile, for example, is $9sqft which is less than many other places. Often you go to a swanky store and you find affordable things. Besides, do you have any idea what a small area we're tiling?! The kitchen is tiny; it's not like re-doing a normal kitchen. Sure, HenryBuilt is more than doing it from Home Depot, but I am in the food business and this is important. The bathroom fixtures - turns out there are some great knock-offs out there of the designy stuff, and we're looking into those. Summary: we are trying to do a beautiful job, while saving as much as possible and not buying cheap crap that we'll have to replace soon - that, to us, is living simply.

TIMING: You're right, we're behind. Do you know people who aren't in a renovation| Sure, there's stress (that's what Maxwell meant when he referred to last night as "tense" - that's putting it mildly) but I think that's to be expected. We'll get it done somehow. We have incredible supportive friends in the neighborhood who will cook for us in those first weeks, so even if there isn't a sink or a fully functioning kitchen, so what. I don't expect that to be an "easy" phase anyway.

THE FACT THAT IT'S A RENTAL: I can't tell you for how many umpteen years Maxwell has had this apartment. Landlord is like family, and she knows we plan to stay in one way or another for a long time. We shopped for a place to buy for 14 long, painful months (thankfully for you we didn't blog that humiliating project!) and we decided to stay put and invest a little in our current home, with our wonderful landlord's complete blessing.

THE MOTHER BEING A SAINT: I don't know about being a candidate for sainthood, but I do know that I'm pretty easy-going and I have known and loved this man for 6 years now. I know motherhood will be a big new challenge, but we're ready to do it, together, and we know the only way to make it go relatively smoothly is to support each other, and ask from our community around us for support.

We hope you'll all give us support and help keep this project positive - we need you!

Cherner is tres sexy, but Camogli is the keeper. Texture, style and back support.

Yikes! Do not get a chair a toddler may ever come near with a woven back, or seat, or anything. Picture smeared peanut butter, spilled milk, projectile vomit, play-doh, overall buttons getting caught in the weave as you lift child up, or the lovely chair tipping over right on to the well constructed block city on the floor: "rippppp." Been there, gave the surviving chairs away and now use sturdy (untippable)wood DR bench from Pottery Barn (floor sample). Kids are hard on things, and I have really good kids.

RE baby: I'm thinking it would certainly simply matters to breast-feed baby!)

RE improvements: Everyone has different priorities. For some it's vacations, cars, collections -- what's the difference -- they are realizing their dreams and I say "good for them." Considering the costs of living in NYC, I would think it's necessary for residents to think out of the box in order to realize dreams. We all do the best we can and life is short, so I see nothing wrong with their plan if it makes them happy -- since they intend to stay in their apartment for some time, I can see where it would be worth it to enjoy their environment during the coming, best years of their lives. If they did own the unit and made these improvements, just as cars do, the improvements would depreciate anyway and, most probably, being design-oriented people, they'd be ready for a re-do in ten years. It's all relative!

Not sure what happened to my comments which I tried to post earlier, but here again.

My opinion is its your place. If you both want the new kitchen (SKG's area of expertise) then go for what you agree on. AT is about choices that make your space a more satifactory home for "you", not just about being frugal for the sake of being frugal or simple for simplicity's sake.

All clucking aside we're all concerned for the three of you and hope this all goes smoothly or at least not ending in blown up townhouses (as Curtis mentioned on another thread). ;-)

Here's a thought -- and it may be too late to even consider. Why not postpone all of it until the baby is three months old, a settled baby? All the apartment will need in the interval is a moses basket or someother floor/table suitable sleeping place for the baby, a changing mat or mattress that can be folded up and tucked away when not in use, a few outfits, etc and that's really it. In the early months there may be no need to alter the space at all, and at three months this amazing thing happens, to parents and babies, a sort of ease and peace can descend.

We had, by all my relatives estimations, an "easy time of it", nevertheless, at the 12-week mark, something still changed. It felt like our little trio was solid. Before having my daughter, I'd heard this from countless others, and we used it to time when we'd move from a house to a small apt. While in the house we bought very little in the way of things for the baby, less to move when the time came, and it worked out fine.

I think you might find you are both far more equipped to see the project through smoothly (forgive the presumptious tone -- there's almost no other way to sound under the circumstances: semi-anonymous advice) if you allow youself some time with no projects, no upheaval, just the three of you in a space that makes you feel comfortable and safe.

Sara Kate, I don't think anyone is being unsupportive. I also don't think we are making value judgements on the kind of people you and Maxwell are. I just think we are expressing concern. You are both very idealistic and I think Wende's realistic suggestion that you have a plan B makes very very good sense. Regarding putting money into the rental, I still think it's a bad move, but that's just me. I just don't think, after the baby arrives, you are going to want to live in that kind of situation for long. I wish you had waited to make renovation decisions until you had some sense of where you will want to be. You just have no way of knowing yet.

Just saw your post SK. Please disregard my second post if too much has been done to consider it. All the best to you both!

I'm surprised no one has recommended the Prouve chair. That is definitely my favorite. Good luck!

Correction: baby....certainly "simplify"

SK - good point on the cost relative to the size of the space you are remodeling.

I remember looking at AnnSacks tile and being horrified at the cost - until I calculated the area that needed to be backsplashed. It was a splurge but a reasonable one.

I ended up going in a different direction for my backsplash for other reasons - but it was an interesting lesson for me on the potential affordability of luxuries. I just have to be careful not to use that rationalization TOO much!

As long as you guys share a common vision (about renovation and life with baby) - I think you'll survive and thrive! All the best.

I prefer the Prouve. It's lovely.

Good luck to you both in the coming months.

The Cherner and Prove chairs are hot hot hot... but have you seen this one?

http://hivemodern.com/products/?view=sub_product&sid=800&cid=81&cid2=206

It is truly super comfortable... At the Vitra Store near 14th Street.

Anyway, looking forward to seeing the finished place!

Ummm, maybe you should just buy a crib and a car seat and call it a day.

I say Cherner, I like the clean lines.


I'm mid renovation doing many of the same things you two are about to get into and I wish you the best of luck! I'm also super jealous you're going HenryBuilt since due to money I have to wait a while before hitting the kitchen. Your pictures are going to be great!

I've bought an apartment in NY, and I've renovated a kitchen in NY, so I have a good idea of the costs involved in each. And seriously, redoing a kitchen and bathroom in a rental is peanuts compared to a) buying an apartment, or b) even moving to a new apartment across town. And a lot less stressful.

I wouldn't do the Cherner as it doesn't have a real back and would require a toddler to have lots of upper body strength to be able to use. I know you'll probably have high chairs and such but the other two chairs might be both adult and toddler friendly when she or he is ready to practice sitting in real chairs.

one piece of advice: just make sure that whichever chair you purchase can hold the post-birth donut pillow (I'm only half-joking)

I love Camogli, but think it would be less forgiving of toddlers using it to pull to a standing position (with sticky fingers, of course!)

I don't understand why everyone is so concerned about the rental--living in a rented place that isn't your style and you don't consider to be a real home is sad.....good for you guys.

ok, i've learned a few things from reading this blog (and from watching small space big style). one, people do all sorts of crazy, beautiful renovations to their nyc apartments. two, people somehow manage to live in incredibly small spaces with babies and spouses. skgr & mgr, congrats to you both. i know you will make your space work for you and the new baby!

Prouve!

I LOVE the Cherner. Go with that one.

I'm sure your place will be wonderful. My votes for the cherner, although I doubt SK will be sitting in it for awhile. Some people seem to be implying this will double as a feeding chair. I have a 9 month old. I bought the eames rocker and have never used it as a feeding chair although we love it as extra seating. The overstuffed gliders are ugly but very comfortable but for me not the right size for feeding the baby. I found a regular chair perfectly comfortable but if you're breastfeeding the Boppy is invaluable.

As far as renovating near the end of your pregnancy, we were having our bathroom remodelled and it was completed the day before our baby arrived. It should have been completed months before of course but that's renovation for you. Although they cut it fine I can't tell you how much worse it would have been if they weren't finished when the baby arrived. The first few months with a newborn are the most exhausting of most people's lives. I hope you have a plan B, somewhere the baby and at least one parent, if not both can spend the first few weeks. Good luck!

I vote for the Camogli chair.

Right on, SK!

As a renter of the same apt for over 20 years, I can appreciate putting a little money (and often a LOT of effort) into making the place your home.

- hey, isn't that what we are all here for?

Best of luck with your coming busy busy months. And count on a dinner one night at my place while your kitchen is out of commission.

Did I mention that I prefer the Camogli chair?

;-)

Been there and done that The joke with our contractor --that we didn't care when it got done so long as it was done before the baby came-- became a plea, and he was still off by weeks (on a "3 week" job) The Dad was 3 hours late picking me up at the hospital because he discovered the new toilet was leaking all over the new floor (and the floor below) just as he was ready to depart. I still can't laugh about it seventeen years later. Not normally a fastidious housekeeper, I found the dust, dirt, disarray and lack of privacy with continuing construction once I was home with an infant unbearable. I hope you are planning on retiring immediatly to the country place and hence the spiff-up there. It would be a wonderful way to start off, and means neither mom nor baby is exposed to any of the potentially toxic materials (and off-gassing) from the construction.

I do wish we had had a baby/renovation shower for you and offered up all our good leftovers for your renovation. I have nine boxes of subway tile that will never be installed and I wish I could find a good home for it!

I, too, think the Prouve best fits the bill. Beautiful lines, easier to clean than the Camogli, and with a traditional back that may be easier on little Maxwells and Sara Kates.

I can totally appreciate the willingness to spend money to improve a rental space. I've done it in the past -- not to this extent -- and have definitely found that it can be worth it. Even with high-quality materials and finishes, I can imagine that it could be much cheaper than buying a new apartment.

SK and Maxwell, wishing you great success, much love, and full support. Thanks for sharing this experience with us.

The best part about this post is the "peak behind the curtains" aspect. Generally, when I read this blog I get all sorts of good ideas that I need to do immediately, and wonder why I am not living in style the way these other people are. It's nice to see that even people who understand the value of a healthy home have to contend with the chaos of life.

Good luck you guys!

OK, I am going to go against the flow here and be supportive through personal experience. I myself was brought home from the hospital to a house that had just been purchased and into which my family moved two weeks TWO WEEKS before my arrival. And the house was in terrible shape: the entire kitchen was ripped out, all the electical wiring was replaced, wall to wall carpeting put down, new furniture, you name it it was happening. This went on for months, my sister tells me that the electrician was there for so long she thought that he was a relative like some newly discovered uncle with electrical skills. And I was the youngest of 4 kids so there were 6 people living in that instead of just 3. And you know what? We all survived.

Now I will say that if you could contact my mom from beyond the grave, I'm sure she would say "It was hell, I would have never done it that way" but somehow the baby got fed, the baby got bathed, the baby grew up to write comments on a design blog.

Maxwell and SK, I'm sorry if you have felt attacked by the other comments--I really think most of them mean this in a concerned-mother-hen kind of way rather than as judgment, but I completely see how it feels like an attack. (Well, OK, the ones about how you are not living the simple life that you espouse are judgmental, and you should just ignore those--if you're gonna get a new faucet and you can afford a lovely one there's no reason why you shouldn't get it!) I just wanted to say that I'm sure you guys will be fine, and to the extent you find yourself in the midst of a construction zone with a small child, you'll get through it and be able to laugh about it later as you enjoy your lovely new kitchen. :)

PS--Pouve, too!

And if you must, you will survive in the bedroom alone. I spent the first two weeks postpartum in the bedroom with the door closed so I could ignore the mayhem around me. That I can laugh about. Baby was in a dresser drawer, believe it or not--no one told me you had to ORDER a crib--I thought you just bought one and took it home!

This will help put things in perspective re home size: Just heard on TV that a woman gave birth to quintriplets, after having previously given birth to quadtriplets, and, before these births, they previously had children; AND, they all live in a one-bedroom apartment -- 11 people in a one-bedroom apt. Think of it this way: our forefathers, for generations, lived in small abodes, one-room log cabins, with large families (before birth control) -- it's only recently that McMansions became the norm! It's easy for a family of three to live in an apartment that is well-designed! I lived in a volkswagen camper van with a pop-up tent one summer on a beach, with a 3-month old baby; the new camper had a lil frig, stove for me to boil water and, looking back, I was the happiest I've ever been (babies do that to ya)!

oh yeah, based solely on the photos the Camogli chair.

My 2 cents: the Camogli. My 2.5 cents: Ignore the Greek Chorus. Based on this blog and very little interaction, you both strike me as sensible people capable of making and living with your decisions (be they right or wrong in others' eyes). But thanks for blogging this whole renovation process; It's very insightful.

I love the Camogli. But i agree, it may not be the best option for clean up with a little one running around. Good luck and ignore the squawking. Whether you you rent or own, you should be happy in your home and you should do whatever you can to make that happen.

I gotta say (before I even finish reading this thread) that I like the black chair to the left, because it looks the most cleanable (with a sloppy baby) and it looks the most sexy (what with the wasp waist and all) and because it stops the eye the least (in a small apartment), so it basically wins on all accounts for me.

All three chairs are good-looking and of a similar scale...I'd say whichever is the most comfortable. One cautionary note, Cherner chairs tend to develop small cracks/delaminations in the "small" of the back over time if subjected to very heavy use and/or constant stress...as when leaning back in the chair. Not a short term concern to be sure, but a concern nonetheless.

Best of luck with everything and don't listen to the critics. It's your H O M E !

The Comogli chair by Piero Lissoni is quite the smallest of the three. W45xD47xH75/SH44cm. Quite beautiful for your room.

Best wishes.

well, I've been gone for a bit, but SK, I want to voice my support for all this again. You'll be just fine. Is it ideal? Probably not, but life rarely is.

I'd like to mention to folks the argument I've made before, which is that all the money you spend on vacations and eating out and so forth brings only memories - leaving a rental that you've renovated is much the same kind of expenditure. (In our case, it's far, far less than the yearly maintenance on our own failed attempts at buying.)

The reason I've been gone, however, is a lesson in the unpredicatability of babies. My little one arrived VERY early last week (31 weeks gestation - not ideal).

Nothing is in the least ready around here (we're still only about halfway through our proposed projects to make our cheap apt. more attractive).

But my baby boy is doing just fine - all he needs to do is grow. And although I was feeling very sorry for myself watching everyone leave the hospital with their newborns packed into car seats, one plus of him being in the hospital is that I get way more sleep than most new mothers. (My older boy is now 2, and I remember very clearly how horrible the early phase of sleep deprivation was.) I certainly wouldn't wish my situation on anyone, but it has its own peculiar little advantages.

If you have a second home, and family in the area, you'll be able to escape from any continuing reno. I think that surviving the first few weeks with a newborn is really all about the support you have around you. It sounds like you have that in spades (except maybe on this blog ;)). Don't be a hero! Let them feed you and do your laundry and generally treat you like a semi-invalid. You'll be better for it, and so will your baby.

We've just revamped our reno schedule to be post-baby instead of pre. And it doesn't feel like the end of the world. Just less than ideal. Honestly, I'm just so grateful my babe is so healthy. There are some sick little babies in that nursery. (I don't mean to sound all saintly here - it's just that seeing how bad things could be has left me feeling very thankful that everything's going as well as it is.)

A friend recently told me that she went through a prenatal exercise where she had to write everything she wanted for the birth on separate cards (no drugs, my own doctor, and so forth), and then take them away one by one, just to get used to the idea that birth - like death - is an unpredictable process.

And just to back the underdog, I vote for the Camogli.

All three chairs look like they'd topple over on baby as soon as baby is at the stage of pulling him/herself up.

I vote for the Prouve. I can already envision the wicker-back of the Camoglione filled with smooshed peas. And if the Cherner develops little cracks, as someone else said, then it could pinch little fingers, or grab and pull hair!

SK and Maxwell...do the thing! I'm very excited, from a purely voyeuristic perspective.

original blues -- so glad that all is now well with your growing little fellow. Sorry for what must have been a frightening beginning. Hope he comes home very soon. Warm wishes to you family.

Oh, original blues - so sorry to hear of the upheaval, but I'm very glad everything is cool. it's good to see you back here. keep us posted on your little one.

Two VERY emphatic votes here for the Camogli. We love all 3, but it seems the most elegant and perfect for a small space. Ideally, get the armchair version -- armchairs are always the most comfortable and this particular one is the most beautiful.

And yes, we recommend this as perfectly sane parents of a 2 1/2 year old. Our daughter has climbed on everything since she could pull herself up, and has never:
-pulled down any chairs;
-smeared anything with peanut butter (pediatricians recommend giving peanut butter a miss until age 3, so we're not even there yet);
-gotten mushy peas anywhere except the table, her highchair, herself, and the floor;
-projectile vomited.
For the life of me, I can't figure out how all this stuff is supposed to get on the back of this chair -- the backs of our chairs are pristine, as are the seats -- which, by the way, happen to be woven rush (and despite heavy play doh usage, they remain play doh free).

Plus, Sarah Kate and Maxwell are getting 2 chairs, meaning they are not intended for the baby (probably a Stokke Tripp Trapp for him/her in time is my guess).

I think Maxwell and Sarah Kate are NOT nuts for doing what they are doing; what they are planning is perfectly rational and sensible. Living in a city where a 2 bedroom apartment costs over a million dollars (way over), making their existing small space as beautiful and as liveable as possible seems only reasonable under the circumstances. I can't wait to see the final product, and am especially curious to see what rocker they get.

Having a baby in such a small space is not undoable; my cousin did it, and lots of other people have as well. It requires discipline and organization, but it is not naive or silly to attempt it.

The only caution I have is around the timing of the renovation -- we didn't manage to get our kitchen/house renovation done when I had our daughter, and I remember how tough those first few weeks were. My strongest memory is of washing dishes and scrubbing pots and pans in the bathroom sink every morning because the sink and countertop in the kitchen weren't installed yet -- yuck! And we never DID get the finishing work done -- backsplash in the kitchen, plus final paint coat in other parts of the house, doors, trim, etc. I went into labour at 37 1/2 weeks on my first day off work -- we had almost nothing at home. I kept telling the dr.s that I couldn't be having the baby because I had no sheets at home for her (needless to say, they ignored me). My advice would be to leave nothing to the last minute, and have EVERYTHING done at least 3 weeks before your due date.

Now, I am pregnant with #2, and guess what, we are redoing the bathrooms, the roof, adding skylights, and trying to get everything else finished so that we can rent the house (it gets worse -- we are moving to Europe for a 4 year posting 5 weeks after the baby is due). As you can see, I cannot find a way to take my own advice...


original blues, I am happy to hear that everything is going well now. Fingers crossed that he will be home soon.

Louise,

"Quintriplets" and "Quadtriplets" ??
that's way more than 11 people...

I think I remember there being a home in Long Island, maybe the one with the red barn floors? Maybe you can stay there if need be?

Honestly, if you have a deal on an apartment in NYC like it sounds like exists here, it makes perfect sense to me to renovate a rental. Even if it costs 75K+, if you know you are not giving it up anytime soon it makes sense. Just to give you an example, my friend lives in a building where her market rent on a one bedroom in a prime neighborhood is close to $3,000. The rent controlled units in her building are about $1100, one is even $850!!! I don't know what the deal is here but that is what can exist. In a situation like that it makes sense to me to spend money on renovating if you know you are not leaving anytime soon.

Just please, please do not be around in the apartment if there is painting and major demolition. If anyone can do this, you two can! It will be beautiful and worth the effort.

Kathryn in that story it was 2 older kids, then triplets, then unplanned natural "surprise!" quadruplets. Plus two parents, in a one-bedroom apartment, according to MSN.

The triplets are 3, the quads just born. I think I would lose my mind.

The Cherner; no question. I am a proud owner and they are incredibly comfortable -- not to mention beautiful (but you already knew that).

OK, now that I've read the whole thread, I have to say that when I was renting I may have spent more than I should have on making the places liveable, but I just don't know how to live any other way but civilized and pretty.

I've seen people live in rented places for, like, EVER refusing to do anything to it, because it was "just a rental" and yet they, themselves, are living in it for longer than most people own! I think that where you live is YOUR HOME even if you rent.

It sounds like it REALLY helps that they like the person that is actually their landlord, too, because it sounds like their just on a much better footing in general.

And even though the landlord won't necessarily ever have the opportunity to "profit" from their improvements, since they never plan to leave... if the landlord decided to take out an equity loan on that property to improve a different property, those improvements they make will help her value and make her VERY, very happy.

I've never had babies, so I can't really address any of the baby stuff, good or bad, except that they really do, generally, seem to be solid enough to make all of that work.

The Cherner chair, in my opinion, is the most beautiful of the three. However, I don't think it is very comfortable. I am 5'7" and hubby is 6'2". When we sat in some Cherner chairs he said he felt as though he were sitting in a child-sized chair, although he also stated it was one of the most beautiful chair designs he had ever seen. The seat and back didn't feel that uncomfortable (although I only sat for 2 minutes) but I just felt a bit like Goldilocks in the wrong-sized chair.

There are Cherner chairs (originals) at my office and they are somewhat flimsy seeming. No one feels completely comfortable in them, and someone once snapped the back off of one when he leaned back confidently. The reproductions seem a bit sturdier, but they are the sort of chair you cannot really drag around on the floor.

I have 2 Prouve std chairs at home, and I love them. They look substantial, but they are actually quite compact. I feel a few scuffs on them add to the charm, and they are metal and lacquered wood, so quite durable.

I can't say much for the Camogli chair. It looks nice, but the back seems like it could get dirty with age.

I was in love with the Prouve dining chair and was all set to buy a couple (I'm a sucker for sexy chairs, which is why we still don't have a couch) until I sat on them. I found them to be very uncomfortable compared to the Eames dining chair (which I was trying to avoid). Make sure to sit on them for a while first!

I can't wait to see what you do with your kitchen. We're going to try to re-do ours this summer ourselves (with IKEA cabs) but if I could, I'd do henrybuilt in a heartbeat.

From watching 3 sets of friends reproduce, I can safely say that chilled-out, happy people stay chilled-out and happy (just more sleep deprived), and high-strung worriers stay anxious after baby comes. No one really changes dramatically, things just get exaggerated. You guys will be fine.

regards,
trillium

The Cherner chair, primarily because of that Christine Keeler photograph (the Profumo affair). Wasn't that a Cherner?

Click on my name for a pic.

Just a recommendation about living in renovations. I just did it for the first time. There was a LOT of plaster/drywall/construction dust that got everywhere. Saying this to make sure that you aren't endangering your new baby's new lungs and respiratory system. I don't have real allergies and ended up with headaches even though I has live in a section of the house away from the construction.

Power to you. Happy parents make happy babies and it seems like your renovations will make you very happy!! peace, celia

My kitchen renovation started two weeks before I gave birth and finished four months later. The kitchen was 9 X 13 and the delay was because my hoity toighty UES building wouldn't cooperate with our contractor on installing shut off valves to the water pipes. We moved our old stuff to our foyer and lived with a microwave and toaster oven for four months, and I visited everyone I knew. We sealed off the kitchen area (the contractors and workmen came and went through the service entrance) and had no problems with the baby because I breastfed. It was fine, it was a great bonding time, and when its over, the annoyance of it will fade from memory.

My only suggestion: using a very thick mil plastic sheeting, make two separate dust drapes. This will be annoying in part, but it really reduces the movement of plaster dust in the apt. Dust reduction from the beginning makes a huge difference at the end. Also, I recommend you spend $200 for a post construction cleaning. We did this when we had our windows installed and it made a huge, huge difference.

uncle maxie,

go for it man. Forget about the consensus, engage the "fracas" head on. Its going to be great.

- Josh

Let's not forget those powerful "nesting" hormones that make pregnant women feel like renovating/cleaning superheroes during the final stretch, no matter how swollen their feet are or how much their backs hurt!

Once the chemical effects wear off, however, watch out!