apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

Very funny. No way I'm going there.

I'm waiting for p(too) to go there.

that's cute but i feel that beds should be soft.
so basically

you are wrong

Always Better Firm: A handshake.

Always Better Soft: A hand_ _ _.

Hey, how on earth is S-K making pastry crust with butter that's soft?

I kind of like soft bananas - i.e. the fruit. And I definitely hate artificially softened water, yech!

Always better firm:

The behind you have your hand on in bed
Leases and Mortgages

Always better soft:

The delivery of sad news
Your Heart

...and I liked Dave's

hmmm, i like soft mattresses too. hard mattresses push up on my hips and whack them out of alignment. leads to a world of hurt.

i like soft bananas too for smoothies. the more ripe the better.

so basically this is ALL wrong ;)

Nice attempt to change the topic after the Caveman/Success/No Stuff post.

Maxwell's horoscope for the week of September 11, 2006:

Saturn is running around frantically and hitting three or four houses this week, so whatever you say, people will line up to tell you that you're wrong. Be especially careful of the words "always" or "never," which are brought to you by the color RED, as in "red cape makes the bull charge straight at you."

I also really like really runny eggs - they taste better and the salmonella scare is over...

So I like them soft through and through. I also like Dave's "job"

I agree. We're sleeping on a soft mattress while away for the week and i'm waking up with lower back pain each morning. Recently we changed to an IKEA foam mattress, its new top-of-the-line, which I love, I mean love. Only problem is as noted by Maxwell, the new foam mattresses have a funny odor that lingers for a while. Otherwise, it is great.

I don't see anything wrong with a soft mattress. After all, most people find it easier to sleep if they are comfortable. I've always chalked up insistence on a hard mattress to remnants of our country's Puritanical roots...just another way of denying oneself pleasure ;-)

have you seen "secretary"
sometimes punishemnt can be fun ;)


also, isn't drinking bitter coffee, eating bitter greens, eating olives, long foreplay, seems denying pleasures (at least sweet pleasures) is pleasurable in itself.

seems in this instant gratification society, maybe the Puritanical roots are long forgotten...

it really depends on whether you sleep on your back or your side. if you sleep on your back, firm is better. if you sleep on your side, soft is better. but too soft is never good.

It also depends on what you consider comfortable, and on the bed frame beneath. I thought it was time to replace my mattress and boxspring, but I set up a bed frame my mom gave me instead. Whoa, nelly! What a change. Much more comfy.

I think a lot of soft mattress are uncomfortable beause they are depressed. As in depressed in the center, so everything falls into the middle of the bed. Guest beds are often the just retired master bed (at least in my circles) and they are tired. They are also often doubles, not queens or kings, so the combination of gravity and compression makes sleeping unbearable, pregnant or not. I thought I wanted a hard bed until I tried a new soft bed. What a difference!

Squishy bananas are the sweetest.

I know what's best always firm but I'm not saying.

We also know but aren't saying...

I agree with Kea. Soft doesn't equal lacking in support. Most people cheap out on mattress sets and don't replace them often enough. A good mattress set is worth every penny you pay for it.

I love my ultra plush mattress and so do all my guests. My mom found she could actually sleep the night through when she came to visit. Now, when I visit her I get her "old" (3 years?) firm mattress (retired to guest use in favor of her new ultra plush) and wake up throughout the night uncomfortable and go home bruised and sore from that mattress.

I think many people who don't like soft mattresses have just never experienced a good one.

I was of the understanding that the heavier you are, the firmer the mattress ought to be, and the lighter, the softer. Personally, I can't figure out what I prefer. I think the ideal would be a firm mattress with a feather-top, but hell if I can afford one of those.

How timely that this topic should come up now. I'm in the market for a new mattress. Does anyone know anything about Englander Sleep Products' mattress lines? Of all the hotel beds I've slept one (W, Westin Heavenly Bed, etc), I've found the beds at Morgans Hotel Group's Clift Hotel in SF to provide me the best night's sleep by virtually eliminating all my lower back pain. The mattress is very firm but very comfortable. The folks at the Clift weren't exactly sure which line they use at their hotel. And it's after-hours at Englander's office; and I'm unable to reach anyone at their corporate office... So, my questions are: Does anyone know which particular Englander line of mattresses is used by the Morgans Hotel Group? Has anybody had long-term experience/usage of their mattresses? Will this mattress set back a few thousand dollars?

I tried searching the AT archives and haven't found a discussion of this line. (The $200 IKEA foam mattress isn't cutting it for me anymore. And my lower back hates the fact that I cheaped out on the purchase 2 years ago...)

Oh my. I'm with Maxwell. Soft mattresses are terrible! My idea of hell is having to sleep on a waterbed for the rest of my life, or a really soft and saggy mattress, or even just a soft mattress in general (I went mattress shopping two years ago and recoiled - heh, heh - from the soft beds I tried in a few stores.) Of course, a TOO firm mattress isn't good either. Happy medium, folks. I sleep on my back, side, and stomach - usually I switch between the three over the course of a night - and I find the hard mattress best for all three. Oh, and this has been my sleeping pattern since I was a small child, over scores of different mattresses, so you can't say, "Maybe you would settle for one position if you had the right soft mattress." Why would anyone ever settle for one position?

(This thread needed more innuendo.)

The ideal bed has a firm mattress, a real boxspring (not a platform), and one of those memory foam pads on top. Really.

Always better firm:

Apples
Spankings

Always better soft:

Blankets
Toilet paper

I think this thread should have some Bow-chaka-bow-bow music.

Yes, "people know this," but most of us, as other posters have mentioned, don't buy a new bed for our guests. Or even for ourselves. My first year of marriage I was still sleeping on a bed I had picked out when I was about 12...and it was seriously depressed (rather it than me, I guess!)

I also agree that soft doesn't mean "no support." When I spent a year abroad I had to get used to a bed that felt like an ironing board...so firm is defnitely not always good.

Go back to 1985, and all the doctors would agree that firm is better. Now, however...they don't. Whatever works for YOU is better. And as a person with chronic pain, soft is much, much better. I can barely walk a morning after sleeping on a hard bed. Soft doesn't have to mean saggy. It should mean squishy but supportive.

Toothbrushes? Stiff. It cleans better. If it hurts, it's probably because your gums are diseased.

I also loathe hard pillows. Stomach sleepers like me like soft and flat!

As to the other things that should always be hard...well...nevermind...

I sleep on the couch with a wooden plank under the cushions to make it firm. Gotta have firm when sleeping.

I like squishy, depressed mattresses (but then, I sleep alone). Has anyone ever had a hammock for a bed? I think I'd like that.

Better Firm:
Your buns

Better Soft:
Rolls

As for mattresses - I guess it also depends on your size and weight. Some bodies require more support than others.

I love a firm mattress, but i've had too firm also. It was the weirdest bed in the world - like sleeping on a cement bed with a thin layer of foam on it, no give at all. I can't stand very soft beds either that give no support. then it just feels like i'm sleeping in a V position with my bum being the bottom of the V.

but I love soft things too... like my dog's fir and my boyfriend's love handles.

Lydia,

According to every dentist I've ever had, your toothbrush should be soft. Hard takes off enamel. If your gums hurt with a soft toothbrush, THEN you are in trouble.
Of course, everyone should be flossing anyway.

Hard removes *enamel*? Now, that's something I haven't heard! I couldn't imagine that it would happen unless you scrub your teeth pushing hard for several minutes at a time. Of course, I think most people don't brush their teeth CLEAN but just perform mechanical motions on their mouths, and what gets clean gets clean and what doesn't doesn't. Stiff toothbrushes remove plaque much faster and only need a couple of seconds in any place, if you angle them right. Soft ones leave "fuzziness" behind--ugh!

What I'm doing works, btw, as every hygienist and dentist who's ever looked at my teeth has been amazed at how clean they are. When I moved and had to get a new dentist, she actually remembered me on my second visit from the first visit as "the woman with really, really clean teeth." And I'd gotten busy and hadn't seen a dentist in a year and a half, so that's the worst my teeth have been since I was first learning to brush in elementary school...

It took me a while to realize that the ads for "fresh from the dentist clean!" toothpaste meant that most people's teeth didn't STAY that clean until their next visit.

Eeeew.

Re: mattresses.
I never believed that soft could be supportive until we bought our most recent bed, which is somehow soft (lets my shoulder sink in when I sleep on my side) yet supportive (lower back/rear doesn't sink too far down). It really is all about finding the right soft for your body. I recommend trying both American and European mattress brands to find the one that your body likes. We spent 2 days visiting ~6 different stores before we found the mattress that we liked (FWIW, Sovn).