apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

"Therapist," you're dead wrong on this one and getting awfully smarmy these days, with this third person reference... Don't get me wrong... I'm a huge fan, and need my AT fix throughout the day, but please knock it off with the un-hip third person stuff.

I love to cook. I love to make ice cream. I moved to a small place in the Village with a half size fridge... it's fine for one person, and the counter space is key, but I can't use my ice cream makers any more because the freezer is too small.

Cooks and Urban foodies, by the way, need to move pretty fast in the kitchen, and use an evolved sense of improvisation, timing, and organization, among other skills (and they often need larger fridges)... So I wouldnt say it's about being a slow-moving lump. For me, it was a tough choice of economy of space. I've adapted. I still cook, and love it, but not cooking as often as before (can't store all the ingredients all the time), and that makes me sad.

i appreciate therapists accurate portrayal of large-fridge people as large consumers and i think the 3rd person thing is funny.

it's not just about economy of space. refrigerator/freezers are one of the top energy drains in a home. you may not drive a hummer, but what's that keeping your condiments cool 24/7? is that what you really "need". more space to stash more stuff and use more energy is easy. it takes motivation, innovation and awareness to conserve.

Thanks for the input guys! I think I'm gonna go for it... I need the counter space more than I need to have a lifetime supply of cheese. I'm still worried about the space, so I've decided to just bring a bunch of my recyclables to the store and see if I can get everything to fit. Other than juice, condiments and the aforementioned cheese, I don't have a whole lot in my fridge ever -- I just noticed yesterday that I still had a piece of tape holding my egg tray shut. I figure the next person who buys my place can always buy their own fancy fridge and put in a dishwasher or something...

I think the Therapist's use of the third person is tongue in cheek and at times refers to his partner and self. Just my $.02.

I have been on the hunt for undercounter refrigerators as well and was also concerned about freezer space. If you have the space and the money, I would go for separate refrigerator and freezer units. Yes, subzero makes them but summit does as well- you can see them at Gringers at 1st ave and 2nd st. They are about $600 a piece but I think the subzero units are double that.

I just bought an undercounter fridge (no freezer compartment) on C.L., and am now hunting for an undercounter freezer. Will be converting sometime soon. I'm not a huge entertainer and most of the food I buy spoils anyway. Maybe it will be good for me to bend and squat. We'll see how I feel in a couple years.

I am so not a foodie. I really cook about three times a year. Most of my food comes in a box with instructions on the outside...

Avanti makes a small fridge with a separate freezer compartment, so that's the one I'm looking at for now. It's hard to find a small freezer, but I know that Avanti also makes one of them -- they use it at my vet for vaccines. There's also a smaller company based in the city [Summit?] that makes a good smaller cube freezer, if you know you won't be using a whole freezer. Since it is smaller, maybe it'd be a good solution for our ice cream lover? You could put it in a closet or under the sink. At the high end, SubZero makes freezer drawers. GE also makes drawers, but I don't know if they make a freezer drawer unit.

I went the opposite direction--from a half-fridge to a fullsize, and must say I'm enjoying the fullsize. The main reason for me is that I can keep more longer-term items around, both in the freezer and the fridge. I'm all for daily shopping for fresh fruit and veg., but I like to make up large batches of pasta sauce, chili, etc. and keep them in the freezer for later use. I think it's a trade-off. It all depends on what you'll use the liberated air space for.

A problem with the smaller fridges is all the stooping required each time you're thirsty.
They're great for space, bad for knees.

I would have to concur about the larger fridge being better. I cook a lot at home, and I can't imagine dealing with less space (anyway, where else but NY can you get condiments from so many different countries?). Plus, you end up buying a lot of things (milk, yogurt, orange juice) in smaller containers - more containers+more often=more landfill

I had thought about getting an under-the-counter model, too, but was worried that they would be too inflexible (what if I have guests? Or a party?) and I do not like crouching.

That is why the ConServ is getting such good reviews. I just bought one and I can't be happier. LG makes similar models that are less expensive, too. Just check out their bottom-mount freezer section on their website (www.lge.com ?) Either way, they are very unobtrusive in comparison to a full-size. I also sent the info on the wholesaler I contacted to MGR, so hopefully they recommend him on the website. This guy was VERY cheap and delivery was quick.

I have lived in an apartment with an undercounter refrigerator for three years, and it is the only thing about my apartment that makes me want to move. My "freezer" isn't even large enough to hold a pint of Ben & Jerry's. I hate it! I've asked my landlord to let me know when an apartment with a 2/3- or full-sized refrigerator comes available.

I had a mini-fridge last year when I was living in New York and it sucked. I lived across the street from the grocery, I bought lots of fresh vegetables, but I never had room for a bottle of cranberry juice, decent-sized mayo, mustart, etc. And the freezer didn't freeze-- no frozen waffles, no frozen peas, no ice cream. Now that I have a decent sized fridge I cook all the time, I eat out less, I have frozen waffles in the morning sometimes. It's wonderful.

Matt, Where did you buy your ConServ fridge. Seems
like in NYC no dealer has one to look at.

okay,

who said anything about the need to conserve? Maybe in Japan everything has to be small because everything in the land of the red sun comes in a charming microdot size, but culturally, by and large, this is not the land of small fridges.

Like I said, I've adapted to my half-size fridge, it suits my needs, blah, blah, and few people in NYC actually have the time to utilize their kitchens, hence the proliferation of take out in the city...

but... Think about it... this is Apartment Therapy... maybe this is a leap I'm taking here, but shouldn't there be a chance to consider coming home and actually cooking a warm, fresh meal with or without your partner(s)? And if you need a large fridge to store food for four or more people, does that make you a slow, lumbersome troglodyte (sp?) ? I don't think so. Especially if you're say... a cook, who by the very nature of the work, may need a big fridge, and may need to move at a frenetic pace, both physically and mentally...

I think the decision to pick a large or small fridge should be made based upon a balance of lifestyle and space needs, not lifestyle snobbery and/or guilt over American excess of consumption.

And yes, the third person thing was cute and tongue-in-cheek for like two weeks, but like anything that stays in a cool place like the fridge or this web site for too long... it gets stale, know what I'm sayin' apartment diddy?

so that's my $.02 for the day, and I'm sure I'm going to get hijiki ticked off... and maybe others, but I still long for the days of being able to use my ice cream maker.

like i say, large fridge = large consumer. if you think it's cool to stick up your nose at conservation, well we all suffer for your selfishness in terms of lower quality air and drinking water, damage to our ecosystems and depletion of the natural resources that we all share. that is lifestyle snobbery.

of course there are some who need a biggie to run a business or a family of four, but that is not most of us.

Actually, a large fridge is more efficient than a small fridge. If you need multiple small fridges you will be burning more energy than one large fridge of the same interior volume. Also, refrigerators are some of the most efficient appliances in the home, contrary to what was posted earlier. A large refrigerator can cost about $74 a year to run (national average is about $55). A small fridge of half the volume typically runs at about 60% of the cost of the larger. The largest energy drains in a home are heating and cooling interior spaces, lighting, and hot water. Concerns about conservation are better addressed in your heating and insulation systems.

If you really want to conserve don't worry about your fridge, buy a ceiling fan and use that to cut back on your AC usage.

actually, the fridge is one of the largest power consumers in the average house and that should be taken into account when buying one. it averages 15% of residential energy which includes all those homes with dryers. more than lighting and more than water heaters. more than ac. it runs all the time and the more space you're chilling, the more energy you use regardless of whether it's half-empty.

one small fridge consumes less than one large fridge as max pointed out. most people simply do not need a big one OR two small ones. however, if you have two small units, you can unplug one when you don't need it thereby saving, by max's data, 40% as compared to the big fridge. whether manufacturing cancels that benefit or not, i don't know.

improving insulation as well as windows is great, but since many of us rent, we can't do much about that beyond pressure our landlords. insulating and reglazing is also expensive and disruptive compared to just thinking about what you purchase.

so, sure cut back on the ac too, but 'don't worry about your fridge' is advice on how to be lazy and more consumptive.

In any case, if you do find yourself with a mostly empty fridge or freezer, you should try to fill it up with something -- gallon milk jugs filled with water work well (or quart jugs if you have a small fridge) -- because solid items will hold the cold much longer than air, making the fridge run more efficiently and saving energy.

Wow ... I have a 3/4 size fridge and never realized that I was lazy, dumb and slow. I am a family of one and since most foodstuffs are not designed for solitary consumption, I find the fridge and freezer come in handy when I need to keep a loaf of bread and a 2/3-full jar of pasta sauce fresh. If I had a smaller fridge, I'm sure I'd end up throwing a lot more leftovers and bread away, thus increasing my overall consumption of food and its accompanying packaging. It would also require a big lifestyle change, as I don't cook from scratch THAT much and can't afford to get takeout (and ITS accompanying landfill-clogging plastic bags/containers/packaging) four or five nights a week. Sooooo ... I'm stuck being a big-fridged asshole.
You know, I wish that people could offer their opinions on the fridge issue without being condescending and insulting about it (this applies to the management, too). "Lifestyle snobbery" ... that is the pot calling the kettle black, hijiki. Yes, I like eating easy to make frozen foods, ice cream and bread that isn't stale. Does this really make me selfish? Less evolved? It's not like I'm spending hundreds of dollars a year lighting, heating, and cooling a 21-foot-ceilinged, useless "foyer" in my suburban McMansion. Back off.

i'm merely advocating getting an appropriate-size appliance. to keep your mind on consumption when you purchase major appliances because it effects everyone, not just yourself. there's nothing snobbish about that and if you call choosing the smaller appliance a big lifestyle change, then yes, i would say that is lazy.

just to be clear, paul was the one calling conservation a form of "lifestyle snobbery".

Brava, Bianca!

Maxwell, I hope you're reading all this...

the epa lists refrigerators as 8 percent of the average household energy load. the parcentage varies greatly depending on how and where the testing is done.

this is interesting... you can enter your zip code to get a breakdown on the averages specific to your region.
http://hes.lbl.gov/

Hijiki, I never said conservation was lifestyle snobbery... I used that phrase because I was not pleased with the description at the top of the article of what kind of people use what kind of fridges. So you misread and went way overboard.

All I said was that I didn't like that description, and that there could be very good reasons to have a bigger fridge, i.e., bigger freezer and maybe you need to store more than a can of bud and a slice of american cheese, depending on personal or professional needs.

Like I said, I have a half size fridge, and I've adapted, but that doesn't mean I have to like it. I certainly don't need you to tell me what's an appropriate household appliance to buy.

I'm gonna go have my can of bud now, so the cheese can stretch out and relax.

ok, paul. sorry to offend.
cheers.

http://www.summitappliance.com/

Not to kep fanning the flames, but changing the way you cook, eat, and shop for food IS a big lifestyle change and a single mini-fridge is not going to work for everyone. Some people live different lives than you. Lives that depend upon a lot of ice cream. Luckily, it seems that a mini-fidge WILL work for Mary, so chalk one up for your team.
By the way, I have never actually purchased a major appliance. They are always just there when I check in. Until I'm an owner and can buy one of those European mega-efficient fridges that Moby has, I'll demonstrate my concern for the environment and my fellow man in other ways. And I'm sure there ARE other ways I could save 3% of my total household electricity consumption if I really put my mind to it.

All right, let's all admit that Bianca rocks...

And I hope the Therapists look very deep inside their therapist souls and consider this whole brouhaha... haha!

By the way, congrats to Apartment Therapy for being in the Times Home section today. Thanks for all your great work.

You guys (and gals) are quite entertaining! Thank you!!!

There are quite a few refrigerator drawers coming out these days that might help. The ones I've seen are deep enough to hold jugs of milk and what not. Here's a couple links:

http://www.luxuryhousingtrends.com/archives/2005/07/undercounter_re.php
http://www.u-line.com

fridge drawers make sense. You can have a higher counter too.