apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

I face a similar dilema. I'm not a bather and I don't have kids, so I don't value a tub. Removing the tub could reduce resale value or lengthen the time to sell your place. (My Relator pointed out that customization often will lengthen time to sell a place.) Again, like Wende and others have written, if you're not planning to sell the place in the next three years, removing the tub is an option.

For those of you who are bathers or have kids, would you use a basement bathroom if that's the only bathroom that has a tub? Some people think of basement bathrooms as an afterthought and don't really value them. Hence, my question. (Yes, I live in a house.)

The last time we discussed this, I and some others responded with specifics related to the location of the apt (Park Slope = prime hood for families) and its size.
http://tinyurl.com/mpxwr


In this case, it sounds like this is a smaller place so I agree with others who say that it is unlikley that anyone with children will be prospective future buyers plus I have changed my mind somewhat in that I would now advocate doing what you want if you are not a flipper.

Andree -- my tub DOES fit 2, but I'm afraid it's an exclusive club!

I was about to ask this same question! I'm really looking forward to the response. Everyone I have asked has told me not to get rid of the tub and that it will make the place very hard to sell. I guess I buy that...

But the things is, if you put in a gorgeous tub with a fantastic mosaic tile surround, why on earth would you want to cover all of that up with a shower curtain??

Weird. That other mary is not me...

I took the oven out of my apartment when I renovated the kitchen. I figure anyone who wants my apartment and also wants an oven or a dishwasher or a full-sized fridge will just go ahead and get one. My downstairs neighbors have completely changed the kitchen in their apartment one item at a time. Anyone who buys your place will do the same. A tub is a bigger thing than a fridge -- you do have to hire a couple of folks to get one in or out. Still, if it makes you happy and you don't see yourself moving anytime soon, do it...

I'm a bather, and I didn't buy an apartment that had sliding frosted doors in the bath -- it always makes me feel claustrophobic, which isn't the point of a good long soak in the morning. Of course, that apartment also had mirrors everywhere, crappy appliances and sea foam green tile. The thing that someone won't like about your house is the least likely to be the thing you notice.

Bathrooms are for some people places of relaxation. Having a bubble bath is one of my favorite things to do. So having no tub would take all the fun out of a bathroom. You should try bubble baths as well.

I voted yes for bad, even though it would not deter me personally. I happen to have a great, large old tub, but I wouldn't miss the standard size tubs available these days.

But if you are concerned with resale, the naysayers are correct -- you should keep some kind of tub.

One thought: how about those "walk-in" tubs you sometimes see advertised (click my name for an example) -- I think these would be great for resale as the baby-boomers age and will seek features like this in an apt.

OK -- not sure about the aeshetics, but haven't spent a lot of time researching, either.

removing the tub means you'll never sell to anyone with a small kid – or thinking about having a kid anytime soon. it greatly limits your pool of potential buyers

...AESTHETICS -- my spellings above sounds like I polished off a bottle of champagne in the hottub!!!

If you are already worried about resale, then leave the tub.

That said, it is your home and you should remodel to suit yourself not some unseen buyer in the future.

Didn't we have a survey about this last year? Or perhaps it was an article somewhere else. Women really like baths. Most guys prefer a shower and aren't as likely to spend a lot of time relaxing in a tub. From a resale I suppose you should keep the tub and have really bland colored walls too, if real estate agents are any gauge of it. But are you really going to sell right away? Go with what YOU want if its your place. If you resell to an "older citizen" they may not want a tub either since it could be difficult to get in and out of. Heck its anyone's guess what the next owner will want. Personally I'd like a place with just a large luxurious shower.

Totally agree with "me", very valid good points. If its your only bathroom- leave the tub! A suggestion to give a bit of a shower look to a tub would be to remove your shower curtain and install sliding frosted glass doors in the place of a curtain.. if done well it can look sleek and modern. And they're easily removable in the future when you go to resell.

I don't think that's necessarily true about the kid. I have a bath and a big shower stall, and I could easily have a baby bath in the shower--possibly even more easily than in the bath. In fact, my friend always uses the baby bath in her big shower, and she has a tub in the other bathroom.

I think it also depends on the size of the apartment and the city. In NYC, in a one-bedroom or studio, I think most people would not care. Sure, you'd lose a few buyers, but on the flip side, there are also people who would never even notice there wasn't a tub.

I've seen posts that people wouldn't move into a place with an electric oven, so there's always going to be something that's not perfect and would deter some buyers.

I will be facing this dilema too in the not too distant future... that said, a good friend (and renowned architect) reccomended the european style deep sitting tubs with a shower. she has one in her house in france and its great! the nearest i can find is this Kohler one:

http://www.us.kohler.com/onlinecatalog/detail.jsp?item=103702&prod_num=1490-X&module=Baths

With regard to "good-looking" sliding glass tub doors...I thought about this idea, but frankly I haven't seen any tub doors that are good-looking. Ever. Especially not on a contemporary tub. Any photos or sources?

If you're going to stay long enough for the current rehab to become outdated, please yourself. Buyers won't care because they'll rip it out anyway.

If you need to worry about immediate resale value, you can keep the tub or you can resign yourself to possibly taking a lower sale price as the cost of having the bathroom you want. There's no law that dictates you MUST maximize your selling price, especially as the price of your current comfort.

Heck, you may find a buyer who hates scrubbing bath tubs and only take showers.

I live in an approx. 750 sq foot pre-war coop and we just ripped out the bath tub in favor of a frameless glass enclosed shower. We did give some passing thought to the resale issue, but as many others have pointed out, we figured that we are not going to be selling within the next year or two so why not create a bathroom that we would be happy with today rather than living with something that was less than what we wanted for a couple years, in the hope that eventually that may pay off for us in a higher resale. The truth is that families with small children will probably not buy an apartment that does not have a bath, but unless your apartment is a particularly large one bedroom, most families with children are not going to consider it in any case.

We realized that unless we removed the tub, we couldn't create the modern, clean look that we wanted in the bathroom. Furthermore, the bathroom was pretty small so the idea of taking a long soak within 8 inches of the toilet wasn't so appealing in any case.

I say go for it, in the end, of course, you will lose some potential buyers who are dead set on a bathtub. But, if you do the renovation correctly and end up with a gorgeous new bathroom, you won't have a problem with resale and in the end you will have had a bathroom that actually makes you happy.

One word of caution though, removing a bathtub (because of the required plumbing changes) and installing glass doors (depending upon the kind of course) can be pretty pricey. We ended up spending an extra $5000 or so because of that decision.

good luck!

I am facing this dilemna as well. I live in a 1920's coop in manhattan and was told I couldn't remove the bathtub and replace it with a shower in my small bathroom because of the Americans with Disabilities Act. So i'm keeping the old tub - getting it reglazed. any thoughts on that?

I lived For years without a tub, Abd I Can tell you that even if you only take one bath a year it's Worth it. Trust me.
Victoria

I say that if your apartment is in an expensive market like Manhattan AND large enough to cost the next person kind of a lot of money to purchase, they will certainly rip yours out and do whatever, anyway, because people with that kind of money do what they want.

If your apartment is a studio, there's a chance that the next person will be a single male and they'll love the shower; if they're not a shower person, then perhaps you'll lose out on the buyers who want a tub, because first-time buyers usually can't afford to spend a lot on a renovation.

If your job is the kind where you're likely to move in just a couple of years, then by all means, DO think about re-sale.

But if you have seriously decided that you are married to the city you live in AND you really can't imagine living in a different apartment anywhere, because everything about the neighborhood and the apartment is making you feel permanently happy, then the sooner and more completely you make it exactly like you want it, the bigger the number of years you will be able to "amortize" the cost of it, and enjoy what you will have done to it.

If I were apartment shopping, a place with no tub would be a *serious* detraction. No matter how nice the shower, all I would envision is the expense involved in installing the tub. It's costly to redo plumbing, tiling, etc. As a result, it would certainly lower my offer were I to make one.

One of my upstairs neighbors modernized the bathroom with only a shower before putting it on the market. It just didn't feel "complete" to me - even though they did an excellent job. BUT, as others before me have said, if you are going to stay there for quite a long time, you need to make yourself happy first and foremost.

I just had our condo renovated (1,500 sf) and I decided to rip out the tub. The bathroom was too small to install a nice tub so rather than getting a mediocre tub, I decided to go with a nice shower. Honestly, the last time I took a bath was in Singapore on a business trip. If the tub wasn't so nice, or the view that appealing, I wouldn't have taken the bath. In essence, it's not really about the bath for me, it's just a minor part of a larger experience. I couldn't replicate the view or the large tub in my condo, so why bother with a tub at all.

Frank:

LOVE LOVE LOVE those walk-in tubs with deep soaking, heated jets of water, shower attachments. More people would enjoy the bathing ritual with a comfortable seating position and water that doesn't get cold.

Those things remind me of the original "The Sims" game and the most expensive tub. The "AAAAHHHHHhhhhhh" tub is what I call it.

I'm sure they could adapt some kind of enclosure or a custom made curtain rod and plumb the wall with a shower fixture above. Wouldn't matter to me if there were two separate faucet handle groups.

Yeah, check out the pictures, there's a lady with that "AAAHHHhhhh" look on her face in the deep soaking tub.

And Frank, Aesthetics is hard enough to pronounce, let alone spell. However, if you're serving the champagne, the rest of us will be right over.

We removed the tub in our bathroom, replacing it with a tiled shower.....but we have another bathroom with a tub. Even then, we wondered about the resale value, but the old bathroom was so hideous that any changes would be for the better! Without another bathroom with a tub, I probably wouldn't have made the change.

I'd keep the tub unless you plan to live there for a while and you really don't like it. We wouldn't buy a place without a tub b/c we have a 2 yr old who is terrified of the shower and too large for a plastic baby bath. But, if your place is smaller and more suited to a single person or a couple, then I don't think it's as big a deal.

I'm just jealous of the lady in the picture.

Imgine a nice tub where you can actually stretch out and be covered in warm water, with room to spare.

I'd guess she's tiny, because I've never seen any tub like that.

We recently remodelled out 5 foot by 8 foot bathroom and faced the same dilemma. We decided to have a tub and shower combo. We replaced the tub with a new one. It was a bain ultra deep tub, around 21 inches deep. Instead of having a shower curtain which would hide the lovely tile we installed, we decided upon a frameless bath screen similar to that seen in the link below. It covers about 2/3rds of the width of the bathtub and we love it. Ours opens like a door for when we don't want to feel too claustrophobic while having baths but we can just step in and out for showers. It's much nicer looking that the sliding glass doors. You can buy them and get them installed a little under $1000 or get one made custom, to your exact specifications. Not havinga shower curtain also makes the bathroom appear larger

https://www.brookwater.co.uk/designer.shower.bath.screens.shtml

I would not remove the tub.

I felt indifferent about tubs until I broke my arm and had to take baths for 2 months to keep water out of the cast. In shopping for apartments since then, I simply won't consider any place that lacks a tub. Also consider that there's always something needing to be cleaned that requires a large sink or tub to clean it in.

I just purchased an apartment with a bathtub and I'll be remodeling the bathroom this year. I've been asking myself and others the same question and getting the same response... "the resale value!",(oh my!).

I figure I'm doing this for myself and not for the next buyer. I take a bath maybe 4 times a year, yes it's great, but a beautiful seamless bathroom without a tub is going to make me happy every day of the year.

Brian, when we lived in upstate NY, our basement was finished (it was the kitchen level), and the bathroom down there was the one we used because it had the shower that the second-floor bathroom lacked. (I never dared run a tub for fear the floor would collapse -- very old house.)

In Minneapolis, the toilet in the basement was Extremely Scary and we never did anything about it because the basement was just a junk room for the fourplex.

If you have only one bathroom, DO NOT remove the tub.
Even if you have 2 bathrooms if this one is the master bath, DO NOT remove the tub. This mistake WILL cost you at least 10 grand in re-sale value. You may not be planning a move any time soon but things change in a New York second.

Got to agree - I bought a year ago and am thinking about gutting the bathroom. Fancied putting in a really swwanky shower enclosure, bells n'whistles up the whazoo, no tub. Talking to my broker, his advice: "No-one takes baths, but they like to feel that they can if they want to. If you don't have a tub, you'll get crucified when you come to sell."
Upshot - tub is staying.

I rejected outright several tubless apartments when I was buying. I lived without a tub one hot long summer in a sublet and I hated it. I don't necessarily agree with the sentiment that a buyer will change everything, anyway. That may be true of the super high end buyer or the buyer who buys with the bank of Mom & Dad, but for entry level purchasers, renovating the bathroom in the first year or two is out the question. Think about (1) when you are selling, and (2) who is your likely buyer, based on price point, size of appt. etc.

Depends on the price point of your apartment (or house, for that matter). Above a certain level, you can assume that people will change it anyway. Below that, you want to keep in every element you can. If you have two bathrooms, I think you are "safe" in making one a shower-only. But if it's an only, then keep the tub. You never know when you might need it yourself, ya know!

Just had a new bath delivered today- Porcher Ardennes-

http://www.porcher-us.com/ProductNew.asp?prodID=850

We have a very very small bathroom. My wife would not do a shower only bathroom. We bought the smallest cast-iron bathtub so far as we're aware exists.

I have a tub in the master bath and never use it. Would love to haul it out--it's placed right next to the vanity and collects hair which forces me to have to clean it all the time. I have another full-bath between the smaller bedrooms, so I don't need the tub in the master bath.

Tubs are for use with children, pets, and shampoo and leg shaving commercials. If you have a nice clawfoot tub, by all means, keep it. If you have a prefab shower/tub combo, get that thing out of there...it's an eyesore and a waste of valuable bathroom space.

I've read through all of these messages so far and they are definately two distinctly different camps here posting.. the Pro's and the Nay's...

My two cents is this... if its a Coop or Condo in NYC.. and it is a studio apartment... get rid of the bathtub and go shower instead. This is exactly what I am planning to do right now. Studio's are not generally purchased by large families. It's a one person or two person (starter) situation. It is *possible* you may lose some potential buyers, but it is *also possible* you may gain some potential buyers from this decision. If I were buying another studio apt, I would definatly give MORE weight to a better looking bathroom WITHOUT a tub, over a mediocre bathroom with a tub (and would pay more for it as well). In the last 20 years I have taken maybe 3 baths total. To devote that much square footage to something that is utilized that rarely is just insane in my opinion. I dont' care about the person buying my apartment after me, they can make their own decisions. In a Manhattan Apt where very square inch counts (especially in the case of studio apartments), going the "spa resort" route is a fun fantasy but not very realistic and at best you can accomplish a "I wanted to do a spa look but it didn't work" effect and have a cramped UNSPA feeling bathroom. Part of the SPA feeling is the luxorious room (square footage) of empty space around you as you relax and do not feel cramped. I'm sorry, as much as you want to pretend you can get a true SPA experience in a 8X5 bathroom, its not going to happen (unless you're building for Barbie and Ken in miniature).

Make the *best use* of every inch you have... you do not have the luxory of devoting a ton of space for something that you use once in a blue moon. Compromise on Form/Function and Space and come up with something that best suits you. Like I said above, maybe you will lose some interest, but you may also gain new interest from other buyers who would pay more for a bathroom that makes sense rather than a bathroom that is cramped and trying to be something it can never be.