apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

I, too, engaged in the difficult search for the "right" red paint. I think I found the right balance -- not too orangey, not too pinkish or purplish, not too dark -- in Duron's "Red Alert". I've had one living room wall painted this color for a copuple of years, and it seems like the same flavor of red you may be looking for. Since I'm in the process of selling my house, there are pics of the wall available online:
http://www.homevisit.com/vtour/ht_index.asp?id=15417
Tour pictures #3 and #4 show the "red alert" wall, as does the "main level" panorama. Here, I think, is a more direct link to one of the pics:
http://www.homevisit.com/image/15417/www_lg/2329_17th_Street_NW_010.jpg

Since I've never been able (or had the guts) to enter one of AT's contests (because, among of others reasons, this is a house, not an actual apartment, and is in DC rather than NYC), please forgive this bit of self-promotion.

Remember, red is the hardest color to get coverage with, and the hardest to get an even coat on. Buy more than you think you need.

JG - what a great place. Good luck with the sale.
Guido - I don't know if throwing more colors at you helps but I really like Benjamin Moore's sangria. It's rich and I think would look nice with the dark stairs.

Also to Max's point, you should perhaps test your swatches on top of a tinted primer, and not judge the color 'til after the second coat. You may even like some of the ones you've tested already after a second coat on top of a tinted primer.

I was never a believer in tinted primer. Until I used it as an undercoat to a dark brown wall. I'm a believer now!

How were you able to post a url? I always get the msg. that AT won't allow colons.

I found my perfect red in BM's Morrocan Red.
(I paired it with P&L's Sunglow yellow in the kitchen)

I used a Pratt & Lambert red on one wall, but I don't know the name. The number on the tin I got from Janovic is 1015. I like it, it's got a lot of depth to it, and it changes tone quite beautifully with different light, from blueish in natural light to deep orange in sunlight and lamps.

Twice elsewhere on this site I described some red walls that I did, sponging using three different ones (VERY close in color), that were all Benjamin Moore. When they're really close in color, but not exactly the same, it really doesn't have that really obviously-sponged look, and it makes it richer, and less like some kind of cheap laminate or something.

rr - Thanks.

ebrown - I just pasted the URL into the comment box. I assumed we couldn't use HTML to make a direct, active link, but just pasting the link worked fine.

More on red generally - I think that if you can stand the extra work (medium) and expense (small), a tinted primer is probably a good idea. I applied red (the Duron "Red Alert") over white primer, and although I found the coverage on this paint was excellent (much better than some other reds I had tried, from Glidden and Behr via Home Despot), avoiding streaks or darker/lighter patches was difficult. Two coats minimum are a necessity, and starting with tinted primer would be even better -- both to help ensure uniform coverage, and to reduce the chance that (inevitable) little dings and nicks on the wall will expose the pale white underbelly of the wall.

Thanks for the tips thus far
and the Candycane encouragement -- my artist friend with the stellar eye warned me off it as too cold, although I'm still liking it...I'll try 2 coats of that on a larger swatch, starting at the floor. BTW the stairs can change colors, although I'm satisfied with them now. They are...unobtrusive, and work with the exposed tricolored brick wall 16' away.

jg - enjoyed your place. good luck with the sale. You've got a hotter more mod thing going on there than this old place is asking for. I'm thinking I might need to be a little brownish red. But red! I want luscious deep red. [Curtis, I'll hunt down your earlier post, although I am positive I would mess it up after an enthusiastic start! Mere mortals will be doing this painting job.]

Thanks jg. Also you are absolutely right about primer. Prep work is absolutely necessary whatever color your using, but tinted primer will be particularly useful w/ darker colors. I wash the walls w/TSP, fill all holes and nicks w/ spackle, sand, and then cover any stains w/ tinted shellac, then prime. The finished job is great.

A question on tinted primer:
May I use all these other reds I've acculmulated (3 quarts and counting -- Benjamin Moore doesn't have any good reds in their tiny sample sizes) as primer?
Warn me now!
Is this pennywise and pound foolish?

AND a question on EGGSHELL v FLAT:

p(too) I believe you strongly advise flat, as did the knowledgeable paint store man. I'd like to know why.
I got one test pot of eggshell - Tricycle, the chef-boyardee color to the right in the first photo - and I'm liking that surface. I'm not doing it to make the wall washable, just a little shiny/richer. I've only used eggshell in
a. kitchen/bath and
b. whites.

THANK YOU!

fantastic paint store:

Paint's by George
492 McDonald Ave, Brooklyn, 11218
(718) 438-4161

They open at 6:30 am and close early in the afternoon. The paint is well priced, and they know what they're doing. Nice nice nice!
And quarts don't cost almost the same as gallons, like at some hardware stores... $11/quart for these deep colors.

We're in the process of painting our entire house (small town Illiois) after having the entire house stripped of walpaper (ugh!) and I've spent plenty of time at the local Sherwin-Williams store. Off the subject, but the Harmony (low VOC) paint is fabulous -- we have two small children and are using it throughout the entire house. Guido, do the paint stores you're shopping at have any type of "color match" computer? You can bring in an item and SW's computer matches the paint to it. They also sell samples of paint for $4.99 so you can paint a section of wall. One red that seems like it would warm up a space is Martha Stewart's "Barn" #8380, but sometimes her colors all start to look too average to me. The SW website also has an interactive program that allows you to experiment with colors in sample rooms, though your computer monitor may alter how you see the colors. Flat paint is supposed to hide surface flaws better than glossy. I personally do recommend tinted primers for deep colors. I did a high chair in a deep red and the primer really made all the difference.

Home Despot does the computer color matching, but the paint I've used from there is not as good as Benjamin Moore. That Behr stuff....yeck. Ralph Lauren Polo YEECH - nobody will work with you if you try to use substandard supplies.

I've posted photos of my place before, but I went with "Poinsettia"(sp?) from Behr. I wouldn't necessarily recommend Behr, but I'm very fond of the color.

http://flickr.com/photos/lordscarlet/sets/235515/

O dear, one correction, Tricycle is the paint on Stage Left. The paint on the left side of the photo is Miss Candis Cane.

Nice Doug Moore! Thx!

Beautiful color, Doug Moore.

Late in the game, but my 2 kopeks:

I had bad luck with Pratt and Lambert - only average coverage, and splatter galore. I have been using recently BM, as well as another brand called California Paints - they have three levels of quality (the first is just bad, the other 2 are quite good), and very competitively priced. However, color selection is narrower than BM.

Must, must, must prime, and MUST prepare the walls before painting - meaning filled, clean, dry and SANDED (and tack clothed after that). You will thank yourself that you did it.

Flat is the way to go; I think having any shine at all interferes with the depth of the color - you are drawn to the surface rather than the hue (and reflection, of course, obscures the color). I've just started my bathroom using eggshell, and have to say, it ain't bad - but it ain't flat.

(I can't really "vote" on your color swatches, because god only knows what my monitor is doing to them)

Farrow & Ball may cost a bit more, but I find it's very worth it, especially for the deep colours. You can do deep colours in less coats than in something like BM... I've done two sets of deep red walls, one with F&B's radicchio and the other with BM something or other. F&B was great after 3 coats over white primer, BM took 5 before it was acceptable. For me, this more than made up for the price difference over BM (about $10 more a gallon, or about 20% here in Vancouver, BC). And the paint is such a neat texture--so thick it's like pudding! Try a test pot to see how you like it.

One thing to note--F&B recommends brushing over rolling, so I thought I'd try it. It takes longer, but if you have the time, the results really are superior. After the first coat you'll have all sorts of brush marks everywhere and you'll wonder what's the point, but after 2 or 3 coats, the result you get is much deeper, and much flatter, than I've ever gotten out of a roller. Rollered paint has a very different surface texture. All those little blotches from the texture of the roller.

Good luck! Choosing a paint was one of the hardest decisions in my renovations. There are so many choices, and so many of them seem so infinitesimally different from the others...

Farrow and Ball . . . it's $55/gallon for us in NYC, and needs to be imported.
(sigh)
This painting business is a slippery slope.

If anyone knows how to look at Shreuder paint colors, please post. I'm not getting anywhere googling.

I used BM years ago, I believe Fireball Orange and love it still. To me it reads red. Changes with the light and not orange at all. Really a warm red. You do need three coats at least. The more the better. Now that it seems every other bar/restaurant uses red I am still pretty smug about the choice.

Schreuder has changed its name to Fine Paints of Europe, and it does not have very many colors. They're at Janovic (at least the one at 102 and Broadway), but they do NOT have chips that you can take away with you. I have used them, and they're beautiful. But there aren't very many colors. I've mainly used them on bathroom and kitchen doors and cabinet doors and ceilngs (all of those in what they call "Brilliant" finish, which is a VERY high-gloss oil-based paint.

Other doors, I've used with their "Satin" finish (also oil-based). Off-hand, I'm doubting that they make a flat, much less a latex.

Thanks again for all the comments. I've found out that Janovic/Plaza mixes other makers colors as Benjamin Moore paint.

All except Farrow & Ball . . . I've ordered a sample pot.

Duron's Sizzling Haute or Ralph Lauren ($$$)is what we found to be the best. PRIME first.

Mix the paints together - like the one that is too cold with the one that is too orange- and see if that makes the perfect color. Do it in a separate bucket and make sure to make enough for the whole things before starting.