apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

Matt the Plant Guy did mention this issue on a Plant THerapy post.

I have to say, I'm really getting sick of all this "green" nonsense. I thought this site was supposed to be about decorating apartments. If people buy into this stuff, then fine for them I suppose...but don't assmue everyone does.

I found Matt's post on this really interesting.

http://www.apartmenttherapy.com/ny/planttherapy/planttherapy-queens-own-garden-of-eden-026031

JyoJyo, people clearly do want this, as is evidenced if you look at the large number of responses to other "green" posts, and it certainly fits in well with the mission of living on smaller scale. Living a sustainable lifestyle is becoming more and more important to people every day, and our homes are one of the best places to start doing so.

Rather than bemoan the posts that many of the other readers find both relevant and enjoyable, why not simply pass over them and focus on the parts of apartment therapy you enjoy?

Also, July is green month at AT, so there will be more posts on it than is typical.

Curious what one has to "buy into" in order to find these posts relevant?

If some product, etc. is specifically related to your home, than I can see including a story about it here – it wouldn't matter whether or not people believe the hype surrounding it. But when it comes to inundating people with "How green are you?" propaganda, it would seem to be a subject best left to other forums.

Living on a smaller scale isn't a mission to most people, its just a financial necessity. And, since the world isn't in agreement as to what a "sustainable lifestyle" is, there's no reason to include all of this anti-industrial propaganda... unless you want to turn the site into a political debate forum.

What people are buying into is the hype surrounding global climate change, environmentalism, etc.

No, dear, that's not what "people" are "buying into." But how delightfully dismissive of you.

sunspot, are you trying to say that no hype exists regarding global climate change and environmentalism? ...or are you saying that the hype exists, but that no one is buying into it? In either case, it's my opinion that you're wrong.

I would say that "dismissive" would also mean people writing articles on an issue-neutral blog which assume a shared point of view.

jyojyo don't worry about all of this green stuff. my advice to you is to ignore it. continue using your toxic household cleaners, run up your electric bill with those old lightbulbs. do whatever makes you happy.

you say toMAtoes and i say toMATOes.

lets agree to disagree.
im all for green but its a bit overexposed at the current moment. Not saying its wrong..i like that ppl are becoming more aware but when it starts becoming a trend more than something real..then im "eh" bout the topic.

* oh look at me im an uber celeb-a-not i drive a prius and grow my own food and recycle my own tp and yet i wear clothes made my third world country familes that live on 10 cents a day*

when green gets to that point..i can see how some are turned off.

i hope that ppl who are doing it for show realize that its more than just a hip trending thing to do

Jyo, Jyo, It's become very real that the earth is warming up and it's also very true that much of that comes from greenhouse gases, such as the exhaust that comes from our cars, factories etc are largely causing this warming trend. True, some of it is natural due to the Earth's rotational forces but not all of it though.

Only in America can so many people live in large homes with large yards like we do, and to add to that the over consumption of "things" that many have in those large homes and to top it all off, we have not had the need to recycle like in other countries since much of the resources are right here, many countries have to import those very materials so they do have a more established recycling systems in place than we do here in the US.

Much of the world also live in small spaces and have to make those spaces work due to the lack of space and that goes for many of us here in the US who live in any sizeable city of ay consequence.

That's part of what AT is all about, but at the same time, we can all be less wasteful of what we do and buy and that's the mission of AT as well, especially in their green therapy blog. It's not a "lifestyle" per se, but choices we all make in our daily living to be wasteful or not. It's a choice to live in an environment where our health isn't at risk or not. AT is just offering those of us who want to use less toxic products etc choices to be able to do so.

And as others have said, please skip over these types of posts if you so choose.

you lost me with the assumption about relationship between an awareness of living on a smaller scale and financial necessity. sure, one can can "buy into" the idea of spending a lot of green on "green" products and lifestyles, or be critical of that, but many, many of the topics and posts are about living on a smaller scale by re-using (eg., each day the respective sites start with local scavenger listings) - or at least an awareness of how we consume, which in my view is perfectly in line with a budget conscious lifestyle, whether such a lifestyle is chosen or necessary.
i am also curious to know since when has "decorating apartments" been "issue-neutral"?

I think (and I don't know if this is actually JyoJyo's point or not), that when something becomes a "trend," it can overshadow that actual points that need to be made. For example, if people believe that carrying around a cloth bag instead of plastic or paper, using 7th generation, and replacing incandescent with flourescent bulbs are all they need to do to change the enviroment, they may be less inclined to really look at all the other wasteful habits they have.

Really want to save the environment? Push your legislators for high speed rail and stop flying. Don't work in large office buildings. Buy locally made products that don't have to be shipped from other countries.

I think this whole issue was the subject of a fairly recent NYTimes article.

I don't have a problem with AT (or any other publication), putting out green info, the more that gets out there the better, I just think readers should be aware of the limitations of hype.

josie-

your on point..:)

jose said:
"I think (and I don't know if this is actually JyoJyo's point or not), that when something becomes a "trend," it can overshadow that actual points that need to be made."

I agree. To go even further, I'd say that it effectively stifles opposing arguments. When you're talking about science and political policy, that's not a good thing.

ciddyguy said:
"It's become very real that the earth is warming up and it's also very true that much of that comes from greenhouse gases, such as the exhaust that comes from our cars, factories etc are largely causing this warming trend."

This has actually not been proven to be a fact. There are many climate scientists who disagree. As Kevin Vranes, climate scientist, University of Colorado said about global warming hysteria, "Some of us are wondering if we have created a monster."

There's quite a bit of information about global warming hysteria on this site, if anyone is really interested in other points of view on the subject:
http://www.globalwarminghysteria.com/blog/

jens said
"you lost me with the assumption about relationship between an awareness of living on a smaller scale and financial necessity."

The term "living on a smaller scale" is vague and ambiguous. It could mean "living in a smaller space", "life with a lower standard of living" or even "anything to do with the lifestyles of midgets." I assumed that this site was devoted to living in smaller spaces. If, in fact, part of the focus of the site is to debate real issues, then I don't have a problem with that. I enjoy debate as much as anyone, provided everyone with opposing viewpoints gets an opportunity to speak up.

The hype about the earth's impending doom? Totally warranted.

Hype about green products to BUY BUY BUY? That's hype. Most of what was in the TONY green issue was plain old marketing.

i don't think one needs scientific fact about global warming to justify an interest in and concern about how and what we consume.

I'm all for this Green thing if it means going around naykid like these folks!
otherwise, Comando!!

"i don't think one needs scientific fact about global warming to justify an interest in and concern about how and what we consume."

jens, I completely agree. I'm very interested in what I consume. The problem with the concept of "being green" is that it takes those simple concerns and rolls them up with an acceptance of certain scientific claims and certain political points of view and tries to sell you the entire package. That's hype.

green is all good..but when you put hefty price tags on green things..thats when i get a tad...red.

My big frustration with the "green" trend is discoveries like I made in today's newspaper... you know the black dust that's always on the window sills in San Francisco? That's not pollution from passing cars. That's particular matter wafted over from China, due to their massive economic growth (which is raising their standard of living, so don't knock it) and lack of environmental controls.

A lot of the "simple things YOU can do to save the earth" are harmless and will even save you some nice money -- but they're not addressing the fundamental problems behind global warming and pollution.

The irony is that AT is essentially about consumption. Not conspicuous consumption, because there's an emphasis on deals, not excessive consumption, because the target reader doesn't have anywhere to put the stuff, and maybe for July semi-conscious consumption. But the goals of this site are ultimately opposed to some environmental measures: don't buy cut flowers in the winter, don't paint rooms until they really need it, don't buy fashionable furniture, etc.

particuLATE matter

I swear, all this talk of green is turning me into a cabbage.

Wende: 'A lot of the "simple things YOU can do to save the earth" are harmless and will even save you some nice money -- but they're not addressing the fundamental problems behind global warming and pollution.'

So true, so true. I've been saying this forever here (got tired of saying it again, but I'm glad someone else understands this). I think what's weird about the 'hype' is that people seem to think that changing their lightbulbs will make a difference, without understanding that electricity is produced in large part by coal, etc. etc. Vagary's post is right on. Also: I forget who it was who spoke at the UK Live Earth concert two weeks ago... but out of all the announcers and speakers in between the music, only ONE came right out and said it directly: nothing you can do individually will make a difference unless the politicians are convinced to change the laws they enact and the corporate interests they're allied with.

This probably isn't what you meant, and I know it's diametrically opposed to Maxwell's uplifting view that all change is local, and that the individual changes are enough. Well, anyway... there it is.

wende, if you'd like to learn more about the causes of global warming, there's a British documentary that was shown on the BBC. It's posted on Youtube in eight parts. Here's a link to the first part:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8f8v5du5_ag

I should add that I do a LOT to conserve and recycle... but that's just because I share with jens and JyoJyo above, "an interest in and concern about how and what we consume." For me, this is almost an issue of what has intrinsic value, of respecting my environment and the objects in it. I don't need to think I'm making an actual difference to the course of this planet to find dignity and beauty in consuming less....

Another thing, global warming or not, we're really close to, or have surpassed peak oil, and once oil production starts declining, it's going to have a huge effect on how much oil-dependent products can be produced, and the cost of them.

one thing i've learned while discussing the environment on more political and current events-centric boards is that it can be very difficult to change the minds of someone like JyoJyo . They have convinced themselves that it is all hype, that the earth will last forever, and that the advances we've made in technology and such over the past 125 or so years simply can't have any repercussions.

they will fight tooth and nail and claim that environmentalism is some new fad, some modern hippie-dippie, liberal sort of political thing that came about because of Al Gore.

the environmental movement is neither new, nor is it political centric. it goes at least as far back as the mid-1800s, with folks like Henry David Thoreau and John Muir, and it should be something that EVERYONE cares about, regardless of political affiliations...

"They have convinced themselves that it is all hype. They have convinced themselves that the advances we've made in technology and such over the past 125 or so years simply can't have any repercussions."

When deciding what to believe and what not to believe, the laws of logic apply. You don't have to be convinced that advances in technology can't have any repercussions, you only have to see that the scientific community is not certain that it has.

Global climate change is a natural cyclical process. Whenever the earth is not cooling, it's warming (roughly half the time). There is much evidence that the current warming trend has nothing at all to do human activity.

"the environmental movement is neither new, nor is it political centric."

The age of the environmental movement was never in question. In fact, there have been many doomsday scares through the years, even in recent history. Many people remember how we were terrorized by the prospect of an imminent, man-caused ice age, and before that by the doom of over-population, DDT, California dropping off into the ocean, etc.

We should all do what we can but everyone has their own thresholds. JyoJyo sounds like someone who believes the world is flat but equally ridiculous is the person who said "Don't work in large office buildings." What a pompous suggestion. Many of us are just grateful to have a job so we can care for our families.

And in the unlikely event that anyone else tracks back - and is convinced by JyoJyo's claims about the widely discredited documentary - it has no connection with the BBC at all (why would one claim that it did, based on, err absolutely no evidence at all, hmmmmmmm?)