apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

option 3
who cares if it's Over? are you a design sheep, or do you appreciate your own taste and ability to turn something on it's end to suit your own special needs?

(I sure was digging those Kravitz interiors!)

it's = its

o grammar

er, what exactly IS "fab"? sorry to display my ignorance, but i just don't have a clear sense of what the word actually means.

Any style that can be defined by just one word, hyphenated or otherwise, is over.

I didn't realize "FAB" was the moniker given to this over-the-top, in-your-face L.A. style. As I ranted about on another previous thread about L.A., this trend really seems to have trickled down to residential spaces from commercial spaces--Viceroy Hotel, Trina Turk boutiques, The Parker Palm Springs. (Thank you, Miss Kelly Wearstler, etc.) And, yes, the look feels very off-the-moment-L.A. even though there have been "blips on the radar" of it for a couple of years now. Personally, I think it's great... very vibrant, fun and playful. Very conducive to cocktail-ing and all sorts of mischief. And, as pointed out in the article, purely midcentury interiors now feel staid by comparison. To break it down in L.A.-speak... "Your daddy's business manager's Brentwood house would be furnished in (highly collectible, original) mid-century pieces, but your boyfriend's publicist's high-rise condo in the Wilshire corridor would just be "FAB", right?"

Sooj--Check out Kelly Wearstler/kwid's work for some prime examples. It's a very L.A. glamour/fashionista design aesthetic.

Patrick--I disagree. I give this trend 2-3 more years of trickle-down/mainstreaming and another few years of life after that. You already see lifestyle destination stores like Urban Outfitters merchandising in this style.

Guido,

I'm with you - Option 3 - Who cares if It is Over?

I like what I like and don't particularly care if "it" is over.

Thought we were supposed to be individuals.

And, *oh delight* we've found another way to idolize celebrities.

"it's = its

o grammar"

Actually, guido, you were right the first time, as you originally wrote it.

"It's" (= it is), not "its" (possessive)

(And by the way - why in the world is the Times grouping together the design aesthetics of Lenny Kravitz's and Brad Pitt's homes? They couldn't be any more different.)

And I wonder how the insanely-talented Benjamin Noriega-Ortiz will enjoy reading his "Supporting Actor" billing as "Mr. Kravitz's principal collaborator."

Enrique--
My point was actually that (imho) if you can describe ANY look in one word or short phrase, it is fad/trend and not truly a "style." Just like I think a house *totally* "mid-century modern" is as much a mistake as one soley "fab" or "directional".

Re: "IT'S funny: people just fall in love with these pieces, and they don't care about a name or a pedigree"

Yet the artcile goes on to say that the style really took off with(famous designer)Kelly Wearstler's use of a piece was published in House Beautiful.

Um, isn't THAT "pedigree and provenance"?

Plus, I bet this shop ain't exactly giving this stuff away...

Great interior designers have ALWAYS been about "the good piece" and that the designation isn't really about price or origin.

Regarding Lenny Kravitz and Brad Pitt. I've been to Lenny's Miami house for a music industry event hosted by a previous employer--and it really is something to see in person, a fully realized "directional" vision (or whatever you want to call it). My cousin has worked with Brad Pitt on the lighting design in two of his houses, and she was very impressed with his technical knowledge and understanding of design and architecture.

Their celebrity has afforded them both the means to create their own environments. And their celebrity has also allowed their design "collaborators" to have higher-profile "calling card" examples of their work for their portfolios--allowing them to brand-build if they so choose. Everyone wins.

pphillipp--

I think the Kravitz/Pitt grouping was based not on style but on how now, because Hollywood said so, it's okay for manly-men to be engaged in swatch talk and design chat.

Whew! I thought I'd NEVER get such swell validation!! ;)

If mid-century is over, where will Jonathan Adler find ideas to rip-off -- er, uh, sorry, I mean where will he find his inspiration?

Patrick, I agree with you. I am so over celeb worship. I somehow doubt that Brad Pitt is some groundbreaking architect/designer/decorator. I always found Lenny entertaining, but this article was annoying.

I also find it hard to believe that the Kravitz vision was not in part tempered/inspired by the many over-the-top club interiors he's no doubt been exposed to in his glamorous life.

(and it's actually the Fab article, and not the Pitt/Kravitz article that claims to be the end of mid-century modern.)

ps: I DO in fact like much of the Kravitz interiors, as well as much of the stuff/philosophy.

The tone of both articles (and too-fabulous people quoted), and smugness in any form, really piss me off.

Regardless of anyone's thoughts on our celebrity-obsessed culture, there is no denying that a lot money is being made off of that dynamic. Why else do large corporations go to celebrities for co-branding opportunities (more than just simple endorsements)? Paris Hilton has licensed jewelry at Amazon. Gwyneth Paltrow's jewelry designs are sold through Damiani. 50 Cent has clothing, sneakers, an energy drink through various licenses. Tiger Woods has an editioned SUV. Lance Armstrong is his own cottage industry. How is this any different from Jonathan Adler diffusing his designs through Croscill, Crate and Barrel and Hold Everything? Or Martha Stewart's empire? Or Jamie Oliver-branded and Nigella Lawson-licensed cookware? You know what, it isn't--because it's all brand marketing. And anyone with any sort of notoriety is considered a celebrity these days.

That being said, Patrick and Fiona--the tone of the Kravitz/Pitt article did have a cloying US Weekly tone. But I guess the writer thought the piece would be sexier if he played up the subjects' celebrity as much as (more than?) their work.

Patrick--Who ISN'T influenced by what they see and are exposed to? You obviously appreciate luxe boutique hotels and the finer things in life, correct? But does that diminish your taste or personal sense of style? I think not. But has it not helped you develop/refine it? I know that has been the case for me. I'm constantly looking for something to feed my visual appetite for design... And not meaning to sound like a namedropper here, but I've worked with Lenny Kravitz on several occasions for two years. He embodies "rock star" and definitely lives the life. What you see is legitimate and real--his rock star version of it. I'd definitely give him more credit than say... Kimora Lee Simmons.

This culture of celebrity is childish. "Hey the cool guys are doing it, so it's cool to do it."

But what annoys me the most, are the constant references in the media on how unusual it is for a straight male to be clean, cultured and interested in his interior.

Watching TV shows like Will & Grace, Queer Eye etc... you'd think all gay men are stylish and all straight guys are slobs. In my neck of the wood there are so many gay slobs and refined straight males you would think it's a different planet.

PS. A purely Mid-Century Modern interior is definitely over for me, but Mid-Century Modern architecture is definitely not. I do not/would not live with a "Fab" or "directional" interior, but love the look.

I'm waiting for Kimora to start a line called "I'll Beat a Bitch's Ass" after reading the Vanity Fair article about her. (And like I said, I've always thought Lenny is interesting. He seems to do his own thing, which I can respect, especially since he doesn't seem to care if anyone else likes it.)

I finally just had a look at the pictures in The H&H section, but I haven't read it yet, but I'll dive into this anyway.

"Pure" anything -- Mid-Century, or anything else
-- is NEVER my cup of meat. If what's meant by "FAB" is "whatever works together", it sounds and looks fine.

I think I said this a while back in a completely unrelated post. There will ALWAYS be, as there always HAS been, some kind of looking back. For instance, the whole Napoleonic Empire (pr. "Ahm-PEER") look was imitating the freshly dug up Roman antiquities that people were finding to be such a refreshingly un-fussy classic thing, compared to what people considered to be the excesses of the baroque.

In the 1960's, people were finding that Prohibition-era rebelliousness of the speakeasies and the flappers to be kind of fun, so there were several fashions that harkened to that stuff, and there were some very botanically-inspired art nouveau designs revived because of the whole flower-child thing.

So, there will ALWAYS be something in the air that makes people yearn for things of an earlier time. Which earlier that is will be informed by the feeling of the moment.

Mr. Kravitz has done what we all do -- he has put his own personal stamp on his particular assemblage of existing elements. I'd say that there is a lot 1970's (late-Mid-Century?) to what he's doing. So, yeah, he's just being a different flavor of retro from the Eames-ish folks.

The shock of the straight guy as having a fashion sense is one of the most condescending notions there is. And seriously .. there really is no shortage of dowdy gay guys. Trust me.

I'm not denying the effect of exposure, for sure, on Len or anybody else, myself included.

I just don't like that a style that already probably existed (perhaps created by, egads, by actual but "unnamed" interior designers), is being credited as the brainchild of Lenny Kravitz, as this article makes it seem. Again, reacting more to the a$$-kissing nature of the article than anything else. (Yes, Len, you "discovered" Panton. And Al Gore invented the internet.)

But I DO think there is a huge difference between what's going on here and Jonathan Adler aggressivley finding broader market for something he does for a living already... that doesn't bug me in the least.

Hey, but since the butch Holly-hunks now apparently have the market cornered on style now, and there seems to exist dowdy gay guys, can "Straight Eye for the Queer Guy" be far off?

"Butch Holly-hunks now apparently have the market cornered on style now" Here it is again: THEY HAVE STYLE NOW...

And I am sure you didn't even think about it. I am sure you didn't mean it to be derogatory or condescending. It's ingrained in the general psyche... NOW... Quite funny.

I was referring more to the "Holly-hunks" part with the "now" part, and more about "cornering the market" than whether they *have* style or not, and the "now" had more to do with the newspaper's "breaking this story", but I do get your point.

But my post was basically an excuse for a punch line, more than anything else.

(But, um, also, perhaps it is ingrained so much partly because straight guys themselves shy away so vehemently from stuff like this, lest they fear the dreaded gay label?)

Patrick, what kind of straight guys do you hang out with? What century do they live in? I would expect someone living in some small village in the midwest to think that way but a New Yorker?

Most straight New Yorkers shy away from style and decor? Hard to beleive you and I live in the same island.

Enrique--
No doubt he is the real rocker deal, and I am not arguing that he is not talented... he obviosuly is. AND I really really love many of those shots. I'd move in if I had the chance.

I just find it funny that when this style is done by some, it is deemed overwrought and/or sissified. But when somebody as uber-masculine as Lenny does it... well, that must be cool/okay then. AND he's getting all the credit for work that looks a LOT like the work Benjamin Noriega Ortiz has been doing for YEARS. But maybe par for the course for someone from an industry where "sampling", cover songs and remakes are part of the everyday deal.

I basically just don't like the article's implication... "now that REALLY BUTCH guys like Pitt and Kravitz (he's had SO many women, as the article squeals with straightness proof!), it MUST be okay for ALL straight guys to finally fess up to a love of chintz and Bisazza tile."

Mark--
I have also lived other places.

But even here in New York , even the enlightened guys who want to get laid in a bar on Second Avenue do not lead with pick up lines about setees.

My two cents--

There seems to be a tendency to follow trends in this country; perhaps because it's young. It's nice to see new ideas, but I find mixing many styles (because your aunt gave you this and you bought that), as is common in other places, is far more comforting.

In any case, whatever is "over" or not does not seem relevant; what should be is what each individual likes and is comfortable with.

I'm continuously astonished by shows on HGTV where they make over "dated" kitchens and baths and other rooms that are expensive to renovate because they are "dated." It's not something I "get" because it would never have occurred to anyone where I grew up (overseas) to do their house in any one particular style. Instead, things evolve over time.

My mother-in-law LOVED mid-century-modern and bought some pieces at the time; she mixed them with what she already had. Their house still looks fine. My own aunt liked Victorian; she carried her furniture (inherited and bought at estate sales) from apartment to house to another house and never re-did anything.

I guess that I'm asking why it is that these trends occur. Furniture is so very, very expensive; so are renovations. Changing decor makes very little sense to me.

Patrick, How do you know it doesn't work? Ever tried?

And how many gay guys did you pick up in Chelsea by showing off your knowledge of mid-century furnitures and chintz?

Say "furnitures and chintz" again. You're turning me on.

"furnitures & chintz" There yet?

And the sexual tension rises once again on the Apartment Therapy site... This suddenly feels like Penthouse Forum story I read as a teenager.

Re Fiona's "I will beat a bitch's ass" suggestion. Maybe you should re-think AT t-shirt slogans to include that one as an option?

Terry, "dated" is in the eye of the beholder. Some people like changes others are comfortable in a known environment.

For the record, never picked up a guy talking about chintz in a Chelsea bar.

I HAVE picked up a guy talking about leather at the Eagle, but that's something entirely different.

chiming in to agree about the annoying tone of the article...i didn't end up w/ a real sense of lenny kravitz or brad pitt as *designers*. without that, it just seems like more celebrity fluff shoved into the H&H section, maybe in a desperate attempt to jazz it up in a time of dwindling readership? it's too bad--the writer didn't quite seem to take them seriously as designers and approach them as such, which was a disservice to kravitz & pitt and also to us readers.

and i also found it strange that on the nytimes site, the subject heading for the article is "Guy Decor" (at least that's what it says right above the title of the article, "But What I Really Want to Do is Design").

Patrick, you got laid just by talking about leather? This confirms my opinion: gay guys really have it easy.

Last night I did impress her with how much I knew about the Barcelona chair and ottoman but I still went home alone.

And what is the Eagle? I am missing something here.

This article annoyed the living day out of me:
-Like Sooj, I find it pathetic for the venerable NYT to pick that fluff piece to headline the H&H Section.

-Like Mark, I am peeved by the condescending implication that straight men lacks style & fashion sense.

- Like P(too) I can't beleive Benjamin NORIEGA-ORTIZ agreed to play "supporting actor" to Lenny KRAVITZ (however cool I beleive Lenny is)

-Enrique, I like you, you know it but please stop with the pose (Lenny &I, my cousin & Brad) P L E A S E.

And Mark, never seen you before, hope you hang around. It's refreshing to see another openly straight mal in this crowd.

...male... openly straight MALE...

"gay guys really have it easy"

Oh, don't get me started on this. Talk about stereotypes!

But yes, every time an article alludes to a str8 man doing something that's sterotypically "gay-ish," the author always feels compelled to point out how many "chicks" the guy's "boffed," or how good he is at rugby or fixing a car.

"And how many gay guys did you pick up in Chelsea by showing off your knowledge of mid-century furnitures and chintz?"

Actually, it's not as ridiculous a notion as you think.

But if lots of str8 men start getting all excited about decorating, I'm going to start developing a whole slew of un-consummatable crushes, I can just feel it.

pphilipp, you seem to imply that style, decoration and fashion are exclusivity of gay males. I won't even try to refute that opinion, it's not worth it.

I personally find it absolutely absurd to link someone interest to the fact that he boffs chicks or get boffed by dudes (or vice-versa) ABSURD.

And if the idea of straight males getting into home decor is such anathema to you, you better start looking for your slew of un-consummatables crushes, because they are and have been for the longest time. You don't beleive me? Ask MGR.

Chucky. LOL. Honestly, not a pose. "Based on actual events"... my life. Not that I need to justify anything, but here are a few tidbits. I've been in the music industry for over 13 years in a position that at times requires me to work closely with a lot of recording artists--Lenny Kravitz being one of them. And my cousin is a partner/owner of one L.A.'s best-regarded specialty lighting showrooms--so she tends to work with a lot of high-profile designers and clients. My intent was to add a slightly different perspective to the conversation--one based on a closer proximity to the subject. I guess there was no way to accomplish that without coming off as a bit of a poser... But, oh well, I've been called worse.

Enrique, I believe you. I just couldn't resist a little jab at you. In good fun.

On Rock Hudson...

Anytime one of these articles (or one of those publicists) feels compelled to start listing the ladies linked to that gentleman, I think it could be a front. Especially when I was reading that list in the NYT...some of thems ladies have served as beards in the past. I'm just SAYING . . .

It doesn't concern me at all who those guys sleep with, but the knee-jerk reactions about design and its mysterious relationship to sexual preference does. I don't read any of the gay men posting here as claiming Style is Gay. It's just how far people have to go out of their way to say They're Not Gay that is homophobic (and sexist, cause you know design is really a ladies' thing...ha)

I wish I'd been here Friday for all the fuss -- what a fun thread! Bon weekend!

"I don't read any of the gay men posting here as claiming Style is Gay. It's just how far people have to go out of their way to say They're Not Gay that is homophobic (and sexist, cause you know design is really a ladies' thing...ha)"

Chucky, Guido got it; you didn't. I think you misread about 183% of what I wrote.

Terry--Italians who don't live in 17th century villas buy new furniture. Positing "European" vs. "American" is useless. Most Scandnavians usually can't afford Gustavian antiques. Germans don't have Beidermeier. New Russians have everything new and antiques don't exist in Moscow, except for huge Soviet era sofas (production quotas were by the pound).

But in LA, it's public spaces that influence private homes, not the reverse. Most newly monied people haven't been in really elegant houses, only hotels. Rose Tarlow is the exception in the design community for understanding genuine private luxe, not hotel chic.

pphillipp, you are right. I didn't get it. When I read:
"But if lots of str8 men start getting all excited about decorating, I'm going to start developing a whole slew of un-consummatable crushes"
I understood "if str8 men start getting involved in decoration, I will find other interests, hobbies." Sorry, my English fails me sometimes.

And Guido, if you were a straight man and the label "gay" was affixed on you whenever you confessed your interest in decoration, you would have a knee-jerk reaction. And these allusions are all over the place. I see nothing homophobic in saying "Not because I am looking at chintz means I sleep with Dudes" which I beleive is the point Mark made originally.

Hi Chucky
I wasn't really talking about what Mark said. What I'd like to suggest to you is, REALLY REALLY COOL straight men don't care if people think they're gay. Come to think of it, cool and secure men of any orientation don't care if people think they're gay.

Enrique, could you ask Lenny Kravitz about that for Chucky?

Guido,
I really don't care if people think I'm gay but when it comes up so often it gets on my nerves. Is that normal? You definetely cannot be the judge of that.

"New Russians have everything new and antiques don't exist in Moscow, except for huge Soviet era sofas (production quotas were by the pound)."

Well...perhaps. The whole clean-line, Scandinavian thing seems to be getting increasingly popular with "new Russian" (and new "middle-class" Russians) as a marker of "good taste" - in the past, the desire seemed to be to make one's home as close to Versailles/Schonburn/Petergof as possible. Usually with disasterous results.

But I think the vibe is totally different in Petersburg.

"And Guido, if you were a straight man and the label "gay" was affixed on you whenever you confessed your interest in decoration, you would have a knee-jerk reaction."

Only in a homophobic society. If, as a str8 man the label "stud" or "brilliant" or even - I don't know, "Norwegian" were affixed to you each time you professed an interest in design, I hardly think str8 guys would be upset. "Gay" however, in our soceity, for the majority, is a "negative." Just like "feminine."

Just a side note here, but it's hard to take arguments seriously when numbers are substituted for portions of a word.

l8ter d00dz, this str8 m4n is off to do some l33t haX0ring on teh intarweb!!!111!eleven

And REALLY REALLY COOL gay men don't care or get offended if people continually think they're straight.

"Just a side note here, but it's hard to take arguments seriously when numbers are substituted for portions of a word."

Wow. How clever.

For the record, I am a woman, living in manhattan, and I have come across many men who seem to avoid the appearance (whether true or not)of knowing anything about decorating or fashion. Sometimes I get the impression that they DO know a thing or two about design, but do not want to give the impression that they do in mixed company. Not everyone who LIVES in nyc is FROM nyc if you know what I mean, and there are definitely some men around who still hold antiquated beliefs about masculinity.

forgive me, but what does sexual orientation have to do with design?

"forgive me, but what does sexual orientation have to do with design?"

forgive me, but if after reading the referenced articles and this thread one still has that question, it can't be forgiven.

Tiny bit of trivia -- and in my case it's just as true as what Enrique said, except with MINE, since it SO doesn't matter at all to what was said heretofore, it really IS just self-serving gratuitious name dropping:

Benjamin Noriega-Ortiz' boyfriend/collaborator used to have a store in Chelsea with cool-as-hell stuff that he and his design partner used to make (and I think they still make light fixtures, but not little retail stuff), and they stocked SOME items that other people made. I WAS one of the other people whose stuff was sold in that store! I used to find abandoned chairs on the street, and tart them up to a fare-thee-well, creating vinyl upholstery fabric out of those felt tapestry things with Elvis, Jesus, Jesus' Mother, Dogs Playing Poker, etc., and upholster those chairs with them.

dorio; "Not everyone who LIVES in nyc is FROM nyc if you know what I mean, and there are definitely some men around who still hold antiquated beliefs about masculinity."

And there are definitely some people around who hold the antiquated belief that New Yorkers are somehow superior to the rest of the country.

The diversity that's here is something that you either embrace or you don't. The places that have less diversity often have people who are used to, and grow to LIKE a lack of diversity. Yes, there are semi-monochromatic neighborhoods here and there, but it's pretty diverse. And most people can find someone who shares their views. Does that make it superior?

Well, for me, it's like the Grace Jones song, "I'm not perFECT, but I'm perfect FOR YOU!" Well, New York is not perfect, but it's perfect for me.

There are many people who live in New York City who would rather be elsewhere, and I think that the country is far too big for them stay here one second longer than necessary. So, I say that if you don't want to be here, get out QUICK, so somebody else can move into your apartment, and you can bloom and grow on land "speadin' out so far and wide".

For the 59 people who think that Mid-Century modern is over...what do they think will or is replacing it???

Well, maybe they think late-Century? Heaven help us.

Robin--A more eclectic mix as opposed to a "purist" aesthetic (completely MidCentMod or otherwise) is "the next thing"--for me personally. (Buh-bye, Heywood Wakefield bedroom set. I know you're happy in your new ranch home surroundings.) But, like I stated earlier, I still LOVE Mid-C architecture and would sell off 2 or 3 of my close friends into white slavery to to acquire an Eichler or a Case Study post-and-beam.

When you can buy cheap Barcelona knock-offs at Urban Outfitters and TV/Film/commercial set designers dress sets with Mid-C furnishings to signify "cool", "hip", "edgy" or whatever, then it feel likes a movement has been completely co-opted by the masses. Not that there's anything wrong with that... but, for me personally, the ubiquity of the look makes it feel more mainstream. And this being a consumer society, and me being a consumer, I've been programmed to move on. And the big wheel keeps on turnin'.

Jon B, I think the point actually was that to be considered a true "New Yorker," you don't have to be from New York (most people here, at least the people I meet, seem to be from the Midwest), but you do have to be pretty tolerant. That's not to say that there are tolerant people elsewhere, but if you aren't tolerant, you aren't a "real" New Yorker, even if you live here.

Fiona, exactly right!

Personally, I always thought new yorkers WERE superior! That's why I moved here in 2001. I had wanted to move here since childhood, so I could be superior too. But seriously, I was drawn here because of the diversity and tolerance I sensed was here. And, the many men, both straight and gay, who are so passionate about design (whether they admit it or not;).

I was just pointing out that just because a man has antiquated beliefs about masculinity, does not mean that he didn't grow up in NYC.

Great, now I can go back to collecting it at reasonable prices again. Whew.

hello,
i just bought a house in the uk that i urgently need to furnish with some house hold iinteroors and furniture including art works and electroniBest regard,

Thanks cs systems.please do get back to me through my email address as soon as u can with thr various once that u have as well as their prices.

Thanks

Best regard,

Thanks