apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

The child's "room" bothers me. It's too like a laboratory enclosure for monkeys, or a hamster habitat. I feel as if there should be scientists with clipboards standing below it observing the play behaviors of the penned specimen. And the lighting in the play area is poor. I feel so sorry for this child. All that space, and he (?) is confined to a closet.

yeah, but (s)he's got easy access to the parents' liquor stash, which they've conveniently left in the open, adjacent to the bedcloset. (Truth be told, I like this concept, and I doubt the kid is "confined" to this space--(s)he probably enjoys it.)

I agree the white-walls make it seem sterile - but feel no sympathy for the child. I loved making small forts and tents to crawl through with blankets and big empty boxes. I think kids prefer cozier intimate spaces

If I had to modify it - I would make the interior of the box more suitable to accomodate the playhabits of a child by adding a chalkboard section, maybe a magnetic gameboard that could accomodate overlays for different board games with magnetic playing pieces.

But keep the cool ascetic white look for the exterio adult world.

Then the child would really have his/her own fantasy play world.

Maybe the play area is a toy storage area and the whole loft is the child's play area.

That is actually how I first saw this but I guess I may be already have been influenced by lofts I have seen where the owners have kids.

However, the more important thing, IMHO, is that this does not just have to be for a child's room. It is a great way of dividing loft spaces and I like it a lot.

I guess you could just do what you wanted to the walls if they were yours. If it was my child, the inside of the walls could be painted in one or more colors, since they would only be seen from the inside. Plus, the upstairs playroom would be pretty freaking neat if I was a kid. All the storage drawers and cubbies are pretty useful, and good hiding spots too.

I like it. I adored cubbies as a kid as well as the feeling that I was spying on the grown-ups, so I can see really digging the combo of hidey-spot and lofty look-out. The lighting can't really be commented on since it's day time. I would probably add some additional color (or a black-board wall) to the play-space instead of blank white, but that's just me.

Kudos. Bravo. Well Done. Great Job. Love it.

I too am distrubed by this cube for the kid. Give the kid a fricking room already and stop trying to be oh so hip and open. and does the kid get closed into that cube at night? there are no windows to see out of etc.

This rocks. At first I thought it was a little claustrophobic, but then I saw that with the doors closed there is still a "courtyard" type area outside the bed. For extra kiddy coolness they should build a ladder or trap door to the upper play area. Then the kid can have the doors shut and still get up to his play space.

You know what? I think this apartment is in my building! I have the same floors, the same color ceiling, the same track lights, the same sprinkler fittings, and the same shaped support columns. I totally need to figure out where this is and see it in person!

Hey that "cubicle" looks pretty good sized for a bedroom in a NYC apartment. Makes a great play/fort too.

OK, so I googled for Edina Monsoon in the AT site to see if her opinion was worth debating and I found that it is not.

Thank you, thank you, Edina! Among other things, there is not sufficient room in that cage for interactive play with Mom, who is just standing up there with the child. Truly, this kind of thing makes me ill. Style over substance is fine if it's just adults, but children should take precedence over being chic. I've posted on this subject before. If these parents cared more about stimulating the child than about how their loft looked, they would have at the very least painted the walls of the "pen" with chalkboard paint so the child could create a view. This is just awful.

At least there's not a tv up there.

And btw, it looks as if this kid has nearly outgrown the space already.

Yeah, this is totally in my building. Now to put my nosieness to work and figure out a way to see it!

Jamie Pup, what a nasty post.

I liked cubbies as a kid too and think the enclosure is kind of cool. I suspect mom and kid play together in the big open space not taken up by sleeping area but toys get stored in the upper play area.

What bugged me was the opposite -- there was no blocking of light and sound coming in from the top of the enclosure, which could make it hard to sleep when others were still awake. I am not sure how you would accomplish this without suffocating the poor kid in his Skinner box, though.

The kid in the photo seems happy and I'm sure most children will let the parents know if they are not happy. Some of the posters here seem to be reading their own claustrophobia into what looks to me to be a cozy, secure private space for a kid, but still not completely cut off from the action. What we can see of the rest of the apartment looks a tad austre (no furniture?), but that's not what the focus of this post is.

I don't know what people are smoking when they say this is bad for the kid. I would have driven my parents crazy asking them for something like this had I seen it as a tyke. That kid's room is HUGE. It's far bigger than my dormroom in college, and bigger than many bedrooms I've seen here in NYC.

What makes people think that all parent child playing HAS to take place in the bedroom? Perhaps this kids room is used like many of us use our bedrooms. As a place to sleep. There's a dedicated playspace above, and plenty of room in the apartment to play.

I will never understand why people think that loving a child means you have to have an explosion of toys covering your entire space. When I was growing up there was a small section of my father's home office area for a play space. It was certainly smaller than the space above this lucky kid's bedroom. I played there, I did art projects on the kitchen table, I rolled balls down the stairs and spent a lot of time flying paper airplanes in the dining room.

Bravo to these parents for creating a great solution the living with a kid in the city.

I agree with Edina M. I loved forts as much as the next kid, but I also liked having a proper room with windows. This seems a bit.....strange. Like the child and all of his/her accouterments must be hidden from sight.

Looks cool though, I suppose.
Clever idea.

Any kid would be jealous of this room (I am right now). It is a great idea for a loft. The square footage of this area appears to be larger than most bedrooms. I'm sure the kid is not forced to stay in the "box" as some people here pointed out. It is an ingenous way to make a living area that a child would love.

This is a versatile modular design that happens to be white, and happens to be used for a child's space. To attempt to read into it how the child must feel in such a space is ridiculous. This is one corner of a living space. There may be other play areas in the rest of the apartment.

I still vividly remember the envy I felt watching Tom Hanks in 'Big'. I would have killed for a loft space to run around in. Throw some neat decals and some paint on the walls of that play space and you've got a winner.

If I'm eyeballing the space correctly, the total square footage in the "cube" is larger than many secondary bedrooms in suburban McMansions, once you count the loft and the "courtyard" at floor level.

They have the whole apartment for interactive play, judging from the lack of furniture by the bookshelves.

wow, some of the comments on this just baffle me. I suppose it's in keeping with the modernism = sterility. Switch sterility for fertility, and somehow people seem to believe children are being abused. That's a pretty huge conclusion to draw from a handful of photos of an apartment.

I would have looooooved this as a kid. It's the modern version of a canopy bed, which I continually bothered them for, and - despite having very traditional taste in furniture - they never indulged me. I loved tree forts and secret hiding spots. No tree forts in noo yawk city - this looks like a great proxy.

And yes, it seems very likely that there are other play spaces in the apartment, even if this is where all the toys go away.

Max, and let us know where the apartment is.

I don't have kids , and I am planning to throw the rest of the sofa and love seat in my apartment, so that I can enjoy some space.

I'll look for some directors chairs for guests.

Folding walls - Love it

Lucky kid ! and the designers seem to be a blaze -

What kind of $$$ are we looking to get the designer design a 1000 sqft , 8 feet celing space

i think it's a great idea. i'm not a parent, but if i were, i'd much rather have the child's area open so it would be easier to keep an eye on them. & when they are sleeping, what is the big deal if the room is tiny? it's like a cacoon. i rather like small sleeping areas. & they could always leave it open. the key concept here is flexible. very innovative.

make that "with the idea that modernism = sterility."

And "which I continually bothered my parents for"

I need a preview option on my comments.

Let me add that I would have *loved* a sleek modernist room as a child. From an early age, I hated ruffles, patterns, furniture with sticky-outy bits or turnings or such, and all children's themes.

hah! well, wende, I make no claim to having had any taste as a small child. I like to think I've grown up a little since then...

Although I do still like a few girly touches here and there. Probably why I dig Domino so much.

Jamie Pup,

Your response speaks volumes on whether you are worth debating. I find it interesting that you must google someone to see if their opinion is worthy of your response. How small of you. You would fit right into that child cube.

First off - There are no bars holding the child in there. It's not a cage.

I find it amazing how upset some people are getting over this concept when many people in New York live in spaces not much bigger and nowhere near as well designed.

I'd take this over my 120 square foot bedroom (with a window) any day.

I am trying to figure out how to make a moveable partition to split a bedroom, about 19 x 18, into two working spaces for two children. the idea being that the wall can collapse, partially in daytime, but provide privacy when necessary. I can't get the link to work, though

To me, it looks like the child has the largest room in the apartment. When the doors to the bed and playroom are open, the child has pretty much has the entire living room! The bed has doors that close into a fort - awesome!!! The kid can close the door is she hasn't made her bed - cool! I doubt this would work for a teenager, but for a little kid I think it's perfect. Very creative... really thinking outside of the box. ha.

overdesigned silliness. what should be "stashed" in the white cube are those ugly books, not the child.

i like this. i would have loved to have a bedroom like this as a kid. when partitioned off, this kid's bedroom is bigger than mine, not even including the loft. i see it partially like a little fort or nest or cubby, and partially like a bedroom door to the tenth power. instead of just having the opinion of opening or closing the bedroom door, one can choose the degree of openness or not with regard to the rest of the space. this is ingenious because i remember as a kid using my bedroom more as a storage space/sleeping area than really ever playing in there. this would save valuable time, via the ability to simply make my room part of the larger space if i wanted rather than having to drag all the necessary equipment in and out.

and i do NOT get this whole book hating thing. something i've never understood about this site.

also, while i'm here -- the open thread deletion wasn't my fault, was it? god i have got to stop with the troll baiting. sorry, everyone, if anything i said was directly responsible for the thread being closed. it won't happen again, and i'll leave AT if people are angry at me and want me gone.

Agree with the opoponax--what's so offensive about the books?

As for the room, I think it's great that their child's bedroom space will really be used (mine remained incredibly pristine and neat while my toys and art projects blanketed the living and front rooms).

Funny, I didn't see this as "hiding" the child at all...quite the opposite.

I love it! I want one for myself.

A few years ago, when I first discovered AT, folks were convivial, and all seemed to be having fun! Now! So much bitterness, mean-spiritedness, and backbiting! I first noticed it in the last Smallest Coolest Apartment Contest, and now here we go again. They must be putting something in the NYC drinking water.

This room is a one little concept, guys. Food for thought, not fascism!

Max, insinuate yourself, please, and come back with a full report!

I really like the concept & the room but I hate the doors. They are too cold & do not seem to be "at ease" when they are open, like a hallway closet door that wants to be shut IMO.

My wife is pregnant & we are keeping our baby in our bedroom for the first 6 months or so. We have a similar design problem, because our apart ment is an open space design exactly like a loft space (about 1100 sq feet, but only 1 bedroom). I am thinking maybe french doors or something like the Raydoor to divide up the future baby room from the rest of the apt.

My wife would never let me close up our kid behind those big white doors (of course she has final say on anything baby related).

Hey Edina, thanks for your response.

It's not as sinister or twisted as all that though. Your view in this thread *seemed* so unopen to debate or discourse that I decided to check your other posts (because I did not recall anything from you previously) to see if you were open to discussion. I discovered that you were not so there was no point in wasting our collective time on it.

Rather simple really.

I'm glad to see others have a more open view on this though with balanced pros and cons being given.

Why do you all assume this is meant to "close the kid in"? (which I really don't think it is)

And even IF so, how is that any different than shutting the door on a TINY bedroom in a Manhattan apartment?

I would have loved this as a kid. Would love it as an adult. And WOULD sleep with the doors shut!!

As far as jamie pup and edina monsoon, jamie's track record for being a TOTAL gentleman is well established here. Edina's track record for being negative and bitter, equally so. I hate that he/she is using the name of such a funny and outrageous character to post such bile.

I like it. I can see why some others don't, but I'm willing to bet most of the people for it live in NYC, where you just have to make concessions to deal with the limited space. I can see how this would be weird to someone who lives in, say, Houston, where space wouldn't be an issue.

When I was a kid, I would have thought this was a blast. I was scared of going down the long hallway to my room by myself. Plus, no monsters under the bed here! (Okay, I was a coward!)

Rick, another option to this idea would be to provide folding cavity doors that similar in idea to those tv storage for a totally open look. The downside is that it's probably something more for grownup hands whereas the kid in photo seems to handle these doors with ease.

I love this. It's a great way of creating a room...for anyone. It's not the least bit sterile (see the toys? see the red coverlet?) I don't live in NYC nor do I have small children, but I could see this being used in a number of ways, including its use for a child.

Seems kind of odd to me now, though, that the sleeping quarters are downstairs, play space above. I'd flip it. Then the closing doors make waaaay more sense.

Of course, only when the tike was old enough to sleep up there, I suppose.

The opoponax:

I was told (in response to a nearly-tearful email) that the thread was closed to allow us all to cool off. I don't know what you posted, but I doubt that the post was closed b/c of you. Thoughtful of you to offer to fall on your sword, but don't.

i was a bit worried because i engaged in some troll baiting earlier, then went back to posting on topic and left for work. when i got home late last night i saw that it was closed and wondered if it had to do with my exchange with jonathan. i have no idea what was posted after about 12:30 yesterday afternoon.

i was enjoying the discussion of 'slender budget' design tactics, though.

Seems that if any of us are/were worrying about whether our comments were what shut the thread down, that may be a good *future* filter to apply to our comments *before* we post...

(including myself in that, btw...)

When I was a kid, my parents bought me a lovely bed. However, my mom said that she frequently came into my room and found me sleeping in the bottom shelf of my bookcase. My point? Kids love having their own spaces, and what might look like confinement to an adult feels like a secret hideaway to a kid.

And P(too), I agree with your thoughts on flipping the play/sleeping quarters (when the kid is old enough). I also agree that it's a shame somebody would use the name of the great Eddy in such an unflattering way. Not only would my favorite fun-loving, wine-swilling, Lacroix-wearing gal have bought this child's room for Saffron as a baby, I'm pretty certain she would have also purchased one for her own use.

But Eddy DEFINITELY would have shut the doors on Saffie!! :)

opoponax--nope, I don't think it was you and please stay. I thought you had some good retorts, actually to troll behaviour. I also didn't think the thread was that bad, considering some of the stuff we've had to put up with in the past. But, it was a long thread of general interpersonal mayhem, insult-slinging, and lack of focus on AT topics. I laughed out loud quite a few times when I came back to the thread and was catching up, although I generally don't believe in feeding trolls, after early attempts at troll taming/repulsion.

I was wondering when someone else would kick in with the Ab Fab references :-)

And regarding the child debate - I think the idea itself is totally cool and versatile, and I think it's unfair to say that someone who dislikes that space for a child prefers McMansions with 500 square foot play areas or themed rooms. It's simply a preference.

It seems that this particular family has found something that works well for them.

And I totally agree about books - they look great and are a surefire way to jumpstart conversations!

anyone else having trouble clicking on any buttons on the big prototype website? i'd love to see more.

P2, what was absolutely wrong about Jamiepup's post is that instead of just not responding (the mature thing to do), he or she took the time to post a snide comment about why it was not worthwhile to post a response. It's like saying, "If I was not a nice person I'd say you are a troll, but I won't because you aren't worth the trouble." It's pretending to be above it, while stoking the fires of nastiness. That kind of stuff ruins my day. I have absolutely no idea what happened in the open thread you all are talking about (I don't read them), but Jamiepup's post here was fully as antagonistic as anything I've seen on the threads I read.

I think Edina him/her self fired the opening volley with his/her VERY typically negative tone.

I think it was jamie pup's (a "him") way of saying "I don't want to dignify that with a response" which (imho) can be a valid thing to post on a thread. Sure, he could have said nothing. But sometimes it's just fine to call people on their tone or negativity or whatever.

Go ahead... do an AT site search for Edina Monsoon. Then tell us what you think.

And for the record, j.p. ALWAYS starts from a point of "benefit of the doubt." No doubt that name rang a bell with him, in a negative way (which it should have) and he checked (and proved) his own hunch.

And, um, you can't REALLY say "This was as nasty as..." if you've admittedly not read what this is being compared to, can you?

p2 hit the nail on the head.
Thanks for the back up and understanding me patrick.

I am as sick as Enrique, p2 and others who have been here from the early days with the tone that a lot of these comments have taken of late and I realize that it is due to increased traffic and our cosy little days are over.

However, if I feel that a well worded retort will make someone think twice about posting more bitterness and bile then I reserve the right (as long as this is an open forum) to do just that.

Of course I realize that this is just perpetuating the free for all nature but if you do a search of my posts then you will see that I tend not to "go negative" and even my posts to Andree are from the point of view of trying to get her to see the difference between the blog format (and what works) vs the forum format that she is used to.

Besides, Edina should be able to take it if she can dish it out.

JP, I'd just rather see someone put their dukes up in a more straightforward way.

Back to the "pod" featured. It really do find it disturbing as a child's room. But as a concept for an adult -- as a guest room or as a bedroom for someone who lives in their workspace loft, it's a great idea. The upstairs part could even be a closet. For someone who has clients come in every day, it would help to maintain a more professional atmosphere if the bedroom could be shut up completely.

I don't want to look at Edina's old posts if they are upsetting, P2. I'll take your word for it. I meant that JP's post was as nasty as any I've seen in the threads that I DO read. I don't go into the open threads because I've seen them get hateful on other blogs. Actually, I've seen sites fall apart because "gangs" take over. I hope that doesn't happen here.

So I went back through the thread, looking for reasons why people don't like the space for a child. The only one I see -- and it comes up a couple times -- is that the walls should have a chalkboard finish so the child can draw on them, and maybe something magnetic for games or hanging things. So far, so good, but...

What happened to coloring books, portable chalkboards, and games in boxes? My entire generation was not allowed to draw on the walls, and we turned out about as creative as anyone else.

Those of us who spent part of our childhood in rentals survived white walls.

Darn, it's difficult to talk about child-rearing without sounding cranky and defensive. Too much at stake...

Like many others have stated, I would have begged my parents to replicate this room for me. I tried to turn my bedroom closet into a "treehouse."

The space also looks like it could easily be changed into a totally different sort of space as the child matures.

Totally fun and charming.

The only thing it's missing is a piñata.

^^^^^ you're killin me!

My kids would had loved this space. And if I'd lived in a loft like this back when we were a 50/50 joint custody family, this would have been a terrific solution - until my girls became teenagers.

I know I said I would not be "visiting" AT any longer, but as we all know, it becomes addictive.
This thread and the closed one prove my point however, when I said earlier the site had become so negative and nasty. And a response made back to me was basically "goodbye and good riddance". But thanks to Jamiepup and P2 and the many of those who express "fair and balanced" comments, I feel maybe things will be getting back to the early days when we were all nice. So, I'm back.

Ah, so. I'm not the only one who looks back on AT's good old friendlier days. When I first found AT, I just merrily entered my bedroom in a bedroom contest, without a qualm. It was fun, plain and simple. The crowd now includes folks I wouldn't cyberspatially invite into my home in the same way. But I'll keep right on visiting AT because the founding spirit does prevail, despite comments.

I am related to these people and I am constantly holding interventions to try and rescue this poor child from this "horrible" and "sterile" environment. How dare they not design this room with crucifixes and Pooh Bear banners like the rest of America!

Also, regarding the book debate: I can personally attest that most of those so-called "books" are graphic novels and ironic celebrity biographies. I believe there is also a 150 piece puzzle of Boss Hogg, but I have to take responsibilty for that.

You people need to stop acting chic and raise that child!

I think this is way too designed and I can't get over the fact that it has this simplifed Andrea Zittel edge to it.

http://www.zittel.org/index.html

One thing that could be an interesting addition is if this "Child -Pod" could be portable in some way. You could attach the bottom of the whole unit to a large inflatable bag that could be filled with air with a few carefully placed leaf blowers inserted into the bag and instantly you would have a hovercraft. That would rock!! I would have loved that when I was a kid. The control for it would be some sort of wireless system so the child could sit in the pod or out in the room.

A hovercraft "Child-pod" that would be sweet.

I don't get that Smurfberry post, but I agree with the last line.

Wende, you are wrong that only the white walls were mentioned as a problem. To recap what I find totally offensive about this space as a child "pen":

The child is isolated in a too-small playpen with three closed walls, and poor lighting -- and is above the other people in the loft. There's no room for a parent to sit up there and play with him. The pen is crammed with toys, but if the child disassembles the pile there is no room to move. There is nothing to promote creativity up there. The chalkboard walls were just a suggestion given the limited space (no room for tables, etc.). It's child crating, and it makes me ill that so many of you all think it's okay. I nearly left this site for good because it bothers me so deeply that AT even featured what I consider an example of our society's sick priorities.

The bed portion is less important, since a child this age could still be sleeping with Mom and Dad, or even in a crib. It would look more inviting if there was a play rug in front of the bed. The separateness of the child-pod from the rest of the loft gives the impression that the home is primarily for the parents, and the child is something they have to accommodate. I'd like to see where the parents sleep. I'm betting it's more inviting than this.

So you see that it's far more than a matter of white walls.

Why does it not surprise me, Pat, that you do not comprehend the obvious sarcasm of my post.

The only thing "sickening" about our society is represented in your insatiable need to piously judge people you don't even know based on a few photos posted on the internet.

BTW I have been in that so-called "child crate" seated comfortably with two children and two adults playing Hungry Hungry Hippos. And guess what? No one passed out from lack of oxygen. No one was buried in an avalanche of stuffed animals. We all survived and went on to play Duck Duck Goose.

But go ahead, continue your misguided uninformed attacks. They're very amusing. After all, everyone knows what a horrible fate it is for a child's playspace to be "crammed with toys." (shudder)

Did you not read my first post in this thread Pat?

The reason I wrote that, as I tried to explain in the next sentence, was that I am used to seeing lofts that are huge playgrounds for kids.

You seem to be the only one (except for Edina of course) that cannot see the huge possibilities for children to play and grow with a space like this. Everyone else can.

Do you think they would allow my company to bring that into my cubicle at work? It would rock so hard to have a nice bed in my cubicle. Very conducive to work flow and genius creating.

As far as an environment for a child, I have to side with "Angry Pants" Monsoon. How dare they shut this poor sapling in such an obviously debilitating sterile environment?? The humanity. This hell-hole is a veritable den of future self-desctruction. Why not let her play with crack pipes while you're at it. I weep for this poor child.

I believe Mr. Chambers brought up an ingenious idea with the hovercraft child-pod. Please let me know when the designs are in. Excelsior!

I was one of nine children - I would have killed (just a figure of speech) for a space of my own like this - I truly have to pooh pooh the criticisms posted because children will love the space that they are in if they are loved children.

Dahlings,

Imagine that. I go away for a couple of days and find that I am the topic of much conversation, all of it negative.

The fact that people are going back to read my old posts to ascertain whether I am "worthy" is pathetic at best and frightening at its worst.

I call it like I see it. I dont feel compelled to give pros when there clearly aren't any. Nor do I feel compelled to go along to get along. Frankly, its not my style. I am going to call it like I see it. I have seen a shocking lack of style on this site and i intend to point it out. I love gorgeous things. I love gorgeous homes and apartments and come here to get ideas and see the beautiful and interesting ways people have adorned thier homes. On the other hand, I abhor tacky and clutter and over the top hipness.

That cube is plain silly and I wasn't afraid to say it. Mr. Pup (if that is your real name)there are no pros so I didn't mention any. As for my other posts that you have googled (stalk much?) they were all straight forward and honest. I never trashed anyone for the pure benefit of it trashing. In fact you nice-nicks are the problem. You don't help people by lying to them. do you think you helped Diana in Minnesota by feeding her that pap about how her disaster of an apartment wasn't all that bad? No you only encouraged her to stay on the same course adding just a little bit more ugliness to this world.

Hate me if you will. But I call it like I see it and will continue to do so. Someone has to tell the truth around here.

Edina, you are certainly doing your part to add ugliness to the world. What's sad is you don't even realize it--and that's a lot more tragic than an ugly living room.