apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

I love leather...when it's on the animals. Buy synthetic...save a life.

This thread is getting further down the page, but I just want to point out I don't object to leather in general or for political correctness, just generally on furniture I find it uncomfortable. Liked the look of the West Elm leather cube sofa in the showroom and may buy one of the leather pillows.

P(too), just to clarify I'm not in to leather harnesses either. ;-)

meh.

i do like the ottoman, though. very hatboxy.

disappointing. their furniture has always been poorly made . . . the display pieces in the store always look like they're almost going to break. now their design is even more boring!!

West Elm's stuff probably looks like Hold Everything, since that was their sister store that died earlier this year.

Boring indeed.

Any word on the specifics of the leather... is it plain old commercial leather (harvested animals, chemically prepared and dyed) or (fingers crossed) sustainable (open grazing, vegatable dye, etc...) in any way?

"I’ve heard that the Indian leather industry is really cruel. Is it really so bad?"

Since slaughtering cows and buffalos is illegal under most circumstances in all but a few states in India, animals are marched over hot, dusty roads for 50 to 100 miles, across state lines, to locations where they can be loaded onto trucks and taken to slaughter.

Typically, 15 to 20 animals are crammed into trucks meant for only five or six, so cattle must climb over one another to find space, inadvertently gouging each other with their horns or trampling and crushing those beneath them. Their horns are broken off, and their nose rings are ripped out during the struggle. The overcrowded conditions are particularly cruel when temperatures soar, leading to crippling exhaustion and suffocation.

Many animals are so sick and injured by the time they arrive at the slaughterhouse that they must be dragged inside. Others have hot chili peppers and tobacco rubbed into their eyes or their tail bones painfully twisted and broken in order to make them stand. Some animals have their legs hacked off or are skinned while they are still alive.

Because of this cruelty, more and more people in India, the U.S., and around the world are refusing to buy leather. In this technologically advanced age, it’s easy to find inexpensive, quality shoes and accessories that are stylish and free of animal suffering.

Watch footage of the Indian leather industry.

(From the "Cows are Cool" website.)

Didn't Hold Everything parcel off its product lines to the other corporate divisions - West Elm, Pottery Barn and Williams-Sonoma?

Anywhoos - while I like leather furniture on occasion, this stuff is cheap looking. And if it looks this bad in the photos, I hestitate to think what it looks like in reality.

I have this nagging feeling that West Elm is going to go the way of Hold Everything. I think they are stuck in a tight spot - they want to occupy the "value" part of the market, but offering design-y, modern styled goods. Problem is that the clean, minimalist lines of modernism and modernist-influenced style really require higher quality materials and finishes to look good. There's a reason most IKEA large furniture looks like garbage as soon as you take it out of the box.

For ex., a Barcelona chair from Knoll for $8,000+ with high quality leather and chrome looks luxe. A Barcelona knock-off for $800 looks like shit.

this looks very "bachelor pad" to me.

def not a fan that it comes from animals...and it's not really that comfortable or practical...

is west elm that bad? my friend is in looove with it and furnished her whole place in it. swears that it's good quality.

That leather stuff reminds me of a fall catalogue I got from Crate and Barrel once.

Zzzzz... Wake me when they go back to their ethnic modern thang.

i don't know that i'd agree with dave.

my coffee table is west elm from a few years ago, bought at a garage sale. after six months in my posession, it's fine. is it the most beautiful high end priceless timeless perfectly constructed piece of furniture ever? no. but it does what it's supposed to do as a coffee table, which is sit there and look pretty. it supports a nice stack of art books and the occasional cup of tea. you hardly need to blow thousands on something Officially Modernist to achieve that.

i also would say the same for my bed, which is a fold-out from Ikea. still going strong after 3 years. i bought it because it was cheap and worked with the space limitations i was facing at the time. 3 years later, my desire to sleep on a glorified cot has faded before said glorified cot has.

i think both companies make great furniture that is perfect for people who want fun modern pieces but don't necessarily need something that's going to last forever or be an antique someday.

I don't know that there's a catalogue out there with a bigger gap between the dream of the catalogue and the reality of what lands on your doorstep.

Does someone else know of one? If so please warn me!

I think the West Elm items fill a market niche. No it's not high end, but my living room doesn't see as much action as their display floor. I've purchased a number of small accessories and accents that I'm very happy with. Have yet to purchase any of the furniture items, but I've had my eye on few pieces which if I may buy if I ever complete my "Cure".
But not a fan of the leather.

Sorry folks, but A) I really like this stuff (in moderation, which i shard to picture when it's merchandised en masse like this), B) so tired of the "it's cool to hate West Elm" vibe that invariably surfaces (Enrique, you're safe on this front, based on track record!) C) hope that those of you on the anti-leather high-horse aren't wearing leather shoes. Or belts. Or harnesses and arm bands.

Wait. If you ARE wearing leather harnesses and arm bands, look me up.

I just worked on a room makeover where EVERYTHING from West Elm was as promised, up to snuff, and virtually unbeatable for the moeny, and then some.

And their new cowhide pillows (black, brown and ivory) are gor-geous.

I have been perfectly satisfied with all my West Elm purchases. These include various wall ornaments, some rugs, curtains and a coffee table.

Yes, they cut corners like using lower-grade wood veneeers, but how else are you going to get to their price points and make a margin? Does anyone seriously expect heirloom quality furniture from ANY mainstream catalog? Even some of the sourced items I've seen at DWR are less than overwhelming from a quality standpoint.

I like West Elm for their their aesthetic. Plus, one can always return West Elm items to Pottery Barn stores for a refund. No additional shipping charges needed.

PS. I'm not a fan of leather furniture, only have two pairs of leather shoes for work, love my dog and hope to adopt a piggy some day. But enough with the political debate on leather. It's probably the first textile we've ever used and a lot of animals make good eats.

There's a difference between sustainable design and humane treatment of animal resources. The two are not necessary linked. Whatever is important to you, vote with your lifestyle and your wallet.

YCH



My neighbhour's father owns a leather factory in India. In fact he represented the leather federation a few years ago. They own a tannery and a shoe factory.

According to my neighbour the only hide that they get from are from animals that have been used for meat.

Let me clarify. I love West Elm. (My last score was the floor model of the Jens Risom-esque chair at final markdown price plus additional percentage-off for minor dings.) I appreciate how quickly they're able to turn around their takes on recent and current design trends. Especially the modern ethnic/global thing they've been doing the past few years and the gentle nods to Danish Modern. Other than the first generation of the platform bed (which I owned a few years ago), I've had no problems with their quality. It's just this particular leather collection that bores me. It seems so safe and conventional for the brand as I know it. (But I'll defintely be giving that bed another look. Everthing else... not so much.)

I think the discussion of leather is fair game for AT. Readers here are interested not just in how furniture looks, but where it came from and what resources it consumed when made. If a piece of furniture was made with forced labor or child labor, I think that fact would be relevant. I don't see how cruel treatment of animals to make a bench isn't in the same vein.

That being said (big breath)...

A lot of people who argue with animal welfare activists tend to say "If you don't believe we should use animals for X, then that means we also shouldn't use animals for Y. Since you use animals for Y, we might as well use them for X." (X and Y can be food & leather, drug testing & cosmetics testing, shoes & furniture, or a number of other things.)

Which to me, is a really weird way of looking at the problem. Analogies would be: "Since I can't recycle at work, no point in trying to recycle at home." "Since I can't donate to every charity, no point in donating to any." "Since I know I'm going to be prejudiced on occastion, no point in generally trying to keep an open mind."

There is still a marginal benefit for animals if you don't buy leather furniture, even if you exploit animals in other ways.

That is, just because you have leather shoes, doesn't mean you should throw all compassion out the window and buy leather and other cruel products with abandon.

In the West Elm case, there are a lot of great alternatives to leather tables and chairs that are made with woods and fabrics. You should at least think about them. (And yes, the wood probably came from some felled trees that destroyed an animal's habitat, and the wool fabric probably came from some poor sheep, but just because we can't stop all harm to animals, doesn't mean we shouldn't try to stop any--especially the most egregious perpetrators, the cattle industry.)

I like leather club chairs and ottomans -- but leather headboards, mirrors, and tables?

Cheap leather is hard to do right, because it LOOKS cheap.

It'd rather see a headboard in ultrasuede than these leather ones.

Dull is right. Zzzzz.

...but I could live with the parsons table if I could pound lines of upholstery tacks into it.

YCH has some interesting points, but I am left wondering - why is ok for me to eat hamburger but not wear a leather belt? Why is bad for me to wear a fur coat, but not so bad for me to put pepperoni on my pizza? Why is one more cruel than the other? If I decide to only eat vegetables, is it then ok for me to wear leather shoes? I happen to like my leather shoes. I also like hamburger. I'm not going to stop either.

And back to West Elm - I didn't mean to suggest its absolute schlock or that its going to fall apart as soon as you use it. Also, I was mainly referring to the larger durable goods from places like this. The smaller accessories seem to last a bit better, both physically and style-wise.

Rather, like IKEA, I find that the larger goods like this don't wear very well over time. They start to look "dated" after a few years, regardless of the physical condition. And they start to look "cheap." I'm in favor of Maxwell's idea of protein vs. carbohydrate furniture. It reminds of the saying - "Buy best first time, cry only once."

This doesn't mean having to go out to Knoll and laying down eight grand for a Mies lounge chair. But it could mean saving up for that once nice midcentury piece you see at the vintage store. Or that beaten up but solid oak chair you score at an auction or flea market that you take home and refinish yourself.

Once I found a couple of very nice Jens Risom lounge chairs (not the webbed kind, but a more traditional Danish Modern lounge) in a warehouse from some cabinetmaker whose son liked to collect and sell midcentury furniture. Only problem was, they were missing both the seat cushion and back cushion. So I bought them for a steal and then splurged on some nice modern textile from Knoll. I found an upholsterer in Chinatown to make me replacement cushions based on a picture who was willing to do it for a good price. It took about three months from the point I found them in that warehouse to when they were all done. But, I've had them for four years now and they are as good as the day I got them. I think I will have them forever. And I still get compliments on them.

yeah, but dave, what's a girl who needs a coffee table RIGHT NOW to do? a lot of my furniture is vintage, scavenged and refurbished, etc. except that sometimes you can't really spend months seeking out that perfect item. so you just go to IKEA and find something you like and which seems like it'll hold up for the next five years while you seek out The Ideal Piece.

when i bought my bed from IKEA, i needed a bed, like, that day. i didn't have the money to go out and buy something classy. i also needed something that would work in the extremely tiny space i was inhabiting, and which could be multiuse. IKEA fit my tiny budget, short timeframe, and specific needs. 3 years later, i'm both financially and spatially ready to start thinking about getting something more permanent. but i'm also thinking about moving out of the city and a bed would just be that much more to transport. my IKEA bed will be fine until i make the necessary decisions.

i would say the same for my experience of West Elm thus far. is it, like, the bestest most awesomest furniture ever? probably not. but it works, and it's easy and you can go out and find something that works NOW, as opposed to scouring antique auctions for the next year.

I just bought the "open-frame daybed" from west elm and had it delivered 2 weeks ago and after hearing so many awful things about west elm was surprised to see that the bed is very sturdy and good quality!
It was the only daybed I could find for under $500 that was stylish and not 'girly' or old-fashioned.

Stefan,

I think some of the complaints about West Elm's beds had to do with weak support slats and them bending or breaking noticeably following modest...um...bedtime activities.

Valerie -- Ultrasuede all the way! I have a light colored ultrasuede headboard that you can literally spill a cup of coffee on without doing any damage. Also for those of you who, like me, have cats with claws of doom, the ultrasuede is perfect. They don't like to scratch it because they can't loop their claws underneath the threads. And political notions aside, I like the feel of ultrasuede better than leather (especially cheap furniture leather).

The boyz at the Eagle laugh at me when I show up in the ultrasuede vest.

People rag on West Elm and Ikea quite a bit, but do remember how much better they are than the alternatives in their pricerange. Think items in the futon family, folding bookcases that crumble under the weight of books, or those weird puffy vinyl sofas.

And while people with the time, vision and sources can spend three months rehabbing a flea market find, but how many people exactly have all of those things? Saving up for that "protein" furniture also doesn't always make sense for younger people who aren't settled and don't know their tastes.

I personally never spent more than $200 on any item of furniture (with the exception of an Ikea couch, which I think was $300)until I bought an apartment and naturally figured I would stay there for a while. I only kept two pieces of furniture through all five apartments I'd had up until then: A small thrift shop vanity/desk and my bed.

With the radically different sizes and shapes of my various pads (square studio! cordoned-off dining area of apartment share! rectangular studio! one-bedroom!) very few pieces made sense from one place to the next, and my tastes also changed radically over time.

Different styles of NY apartments also dictate some changes - furniture that works well in a prewar can become a hard sell in a new construction condo. And the constant need for more storage often caused me to buy weird cabinet and shelf things chosen solely to fit an odd little spot.

Now that I'm finally in an apartment that I don't plan on leaving anytime soon, it has seemed right to increase my "protein" quotient, with some better Ebay/craigslist finds mixed in with nicer rugs, a decent R&B sofa and some good lighting. But rather than leave my second bedroom empty, I did buy a West Elm daybed and I'm also using some Ikea cabinets for storage.

So while I can definitely see the difference in quality, I'm still veyr glad that West Elm and Ikea are out there - and I envy twentysomethings today, whose first apartments are inevitably much sleeker than mine were, with approximately the same budget.

Give West Elm a break. It is what it is, and with some discerning buying some terrific stuff can be found there. Sheets, decorative pillows, inexpensive area rugs... From the new line of furniture, I just purchased two chocolate wood metal-leg file cubbies (item #: 48-7241029) to use as nightstands. I have a high bed and the cubbies are 30" high, so they work great. They were packed flat, the store had them in stock so I could take them right home without a wait, and they were easy to assemble with a power screwdriver in about 20 mins. each. All the parts fit together exactly like they were supposed to, and the things feel really solid. I suspect the finish might easily scratch, but since I'm a single guy with no kids and am pretty easy on my stuff, I don't think there will be a problem. They only cost $229 each, so if they don't last forever I'll get over it.

Hi,

I am looking for a west elm employee who is willing to barter their store discount for use of a bloomingdales or macy's store discount. or barter for a one touch digital scanner or other great like new items i have around my house. or just plain rent it out to me for cold cash.

I know that the quality is questionable but with a discount it makes it perfect for me: affordable

Contact me asap as I am decorating right now.

I have currently listed on craigs list:
computer anti glare screen http://newyork.craigslist.org/jsy/bar/213518072.html
new in box ceiling fan http://newyork.craigslist.org/jsy/bar/213499718.html
new macys rug pad 8'x 10' (can be cut down for smaller rugs) http://newyork.craigslist.org/jsy/bar/213475624.html
Palm VIIx (you can use the internet on this) plus a bunch or great accesories for the palm and all the cds and manuals http://newyork.craigslist.org/jsy/bar/213466994.html
Visioneer scanner used once (this is super easy to use and has lots of great features. http://newyork.craigslist.org/jsy/bar/213489400.html

I've go other stuff you may be interested in, or you can give me a list of other stuff you may be interested in and I can see if I have it