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Ork Posters' Seattle Design Open for Feedback

9-23-ork seattle.jpgNope, sorry, Ork's Seattle poster isn't for sale yet. But they're working on the mapping of the Seattle neighborhood boundaries (the boundaries are the city limits), and asking for feedback. Seattle residents, what say you?

 
 

We'll pass your comments on to Ork.

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Comments (46)

I see several extra neighborhoods that would only matter to real estate marketers. Like New Holly.

posted by akb on 2008-09-23 15:56:15
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I don't think it's terribly important for this but upper vs. lower Queen Anne are pretty distinct from each other.

Also I used to live right on that line between Fremont and Wallingford, and therefore called it "Wallimont." But that was just me.

I'm glad to see this is in the works!

posted by Emmakat on 2008-09-23 16:12:00
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Lucky Seattle! I didn't see a similar call for input when they did the San Francisco map and my neighborhood (West Portal) was left completely off. Oh well! I love the Chicago map enough to forgive all!

posted by laila on 2008-09-23 16:14:10
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Chicago has a similar map of neighborhoods, and it's a wonderful hand-drawn color poster. I used to have it hangining in my office. Here is the link: http://www.architecture.org/shop/shop/item.asp?itemid=634

posted by amandagrace on 2008-09-23 16:15:15
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Interesting -- I've never heard "Minor" used for the area south of Capitol Hill. The street signs say "Welcome to Squire Park," and most people refer to that neighborhood (along with the area designated "Mann") as the Central District. (For reference, do a search of those neighborhood names on Seattle's craigslist.)

Anybody know how Ork chooses/confirms "official" neighborhood names? I'm glad to see they're working on Seattle, though. This is great!

posted by Lola A on 2008-09-23 16:30:07
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Um, where's Olympic Manor? It's certainly not called Crown Hill...

posted by thevioletpear on 2008-09-23 16:50:52
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Seattle neighborhood boundaries are crazy.

This seems pretty good, although I've never heard of Roosevelt, and since Ravenna Blvd. runs right through there, I've always thought of it as the western part of Ravenna.

And I can't figure out what the writing is for the area between Loyal Heights and Greenwood. And I live like 10 blocks from there--I thought that was the Southern part of crown hill and the Northern part of Ballard.

But I actually think that defining a whole bunch of very obscure neighborhoods is part of the appeal of these maps. You can call Sunset Hill, Loyal Heights ,and Crown Hill North Ballard and everyone in Seattle will know what you mean, but it's more fun to see it divided up in to little bits.

posted by lurker2209 on 2008-09-23 16:51:55
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Dude, I live in Roosevelt! We've got a neighborhood association, an annual festival, etc. Keep us in!

posted by tornandez on 2008-09-23 16:55:46
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I was actually jsut on their website wishing for a Seattle on - Love it!
Though I've never heard of Minor or Mann before either - I've always known that area as the Central District.

posted by twenty twenty-one on 2008-09-23 16:59:28
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I think it looks pretty good. I can't wait to get one!

posted by jmcquary on 2008-09-23 17:08:25
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I can't wait for this poster! There is a distinction between Upper and Lower Queen Anne... but I'll take it divided or not. Plus I'm not that partial since moving from QA to Magnolia! ;)

posted by 01beetlegirl on 2008-09-23 17:11:33
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The Minor/Mann thing strikes me as realtor white washing, in a figurative and literal sense. The Central District has historically been a majority (although now a plurality) black neighborhood.

posted by Erika in Seattle on 2008-09-23 17:13:26
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They left out Skyway (west of New Holly) & White Center (south of highland park).... was that on purpose?

They also left out Bryn-Mawr & Boulivard Park.

posted by luxeandjacs on 2008-09-23 17:25:16
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oh, and I second the never heard of minor or Mann! ...wha?

posted by luxeandjacs on 2008-09-23 17:26:54
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I have never heard of the neighborhoods Minor and Mann - and I've lived almost exclusively in that area for the past 10 years. Depends on how detail oriented they want to get - Seattle has lots of mini-neighborhood names. (For example, I lived recently in a nebulous area east of First Hill, south of Seattle U and north of the ID - it was a 3 block neighborhood called Spruce Park, apparently.

If they want to split up the CD, Squire Park is fairly well-known and is a pretty big part of the CD.

I would also advocate denoting East and West Queen Anne - the hill that separates them makes them quite distinct in character.

I've never heard the area below SoDo and above Georgetown named the Industrial Disctrict. Usually, it's just called the industrial discrict in SoDo.

"Pike Market"? Really? NO ONE SAYS THAT. except out-of-towners. People call it Pike Place or The Market. Also, it's not a neighborhood - no one talks about the Pike Place Market neighborhood. It's an area within downtown.

I've never heard of the Atlantic Neighborhood, although Judkins Park is familiar.

I like the idea and would buy one. But if they made a poster that said included Minor or Mann, I'd be pissed and definitely wouldn't buy one. I second the realtor white-washing comment.

posted by demolitionwoman on 2008-09-23 17:31:15
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I wish they had something like this for LA!

posted by SaraS on 2008-09-23 17:31:26
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Born and raised (and living still) in SE Seattle. AND owner of an Ork Manhattan poster:

1. akb is right that New Holly is housing development designation that is not used by real people.

2. I recommend a long skinny "Rainier Valley" working it's way down and incorporating the southern part of "Atlantic", the West side of "Columbia City", The East side of "Beacon Hill", All of "Brighton" and "New Holly"

3. Rainier beach should be divided to show "Upper Rainier Beach"

4. Seward park does not extend that far North, but all the people that live in that area (Lakewood and Genesee) claim it anyway, so I guess it works.

5. It seems a shame to divide up the CD like that, I would make the North part of "Atlantic", all of "Judkins Park", "Mann" (WTF?), and "Minor" into "Central District"

posted by meks on 2008-09-23 17:32:44
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I don't know about Bryn Mawr and Boulevard Park, but Skyway and White Center aren't technically part of the city of Seattle. White Center, I believe, is part of unincorporated King County and neither part of a town nor a town in its own right.

posted by Erika in Seattle on 2008-09-23 17:33:11
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It's missing Hawthorne Hills (would be a little chunk between View Ridge and Windermere), and "Wedgewood" should be "Wedgwood":

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wedgwood%2C_Seattle%2C_Washington

Heh...they should put the Wedgwood Rock on the map! And maybe also the Fremont Troll.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wedgwood_Rock

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fremont_troll

posted by ravennagirl on 2008-09-23 17:47:09
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Well, i guess i live in "Mann," though I have never once heard that name. As a matter of fact, if I said Mann I don't think anyone would know what I was talking about!

Nice to see that my 'hood actually has a name besides "the northern part of the Central District with a Madison Park zip code" or "that area east of Capital Hill and not quite down in Madison Valley."

Speaking of, where's Madison Valley on this map? There's a whole neighborhood center down there full of renowned shops and restaurants: Voila!, Rovers, City Peoples, and Cafe Flora, to name a few.

By the way, the name between Loyal Heights and Greenwood says Whittier Heights. I believe there is an elementary(?) school in that neighborhood that bears the same name.

And, speaking potentially fabricated neighborhood names, when I was house shopping, my Realtor told me that the name Madison Valley, itself, was an industry creation meant to help soften the perceived "edge" of the Central District.

Here's to living in a city full of distinct neighborhoods!

posted by beevee on 2008-09-23 17:53:44
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me again...

Hawthorne Hills:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawthorne_Hills,_Seattle,_Washington

It's also missing Meadowbrook, Olympic Hills, and Victory Heights:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meadowbrook,_Seattle,_Washington

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olympic_Hills,_Seattle,_Washington

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victory_Heights,_Seattle,_Washington

posted by ravennagirl on 2008-09-23 18:03:45
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POWHat capitol hill

Pine-Olive Way-Harvard area triangle

may be too small for the map.

but they are an active group of people.

posted by joeshack on 2008-09-23 18:07:17
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Ork here! Simultaneous to incoming comments, we're updating the hoods at the originally posted site, which is http://www.orkposters.com/seattle.html

The image is larger there too.

posted by Ork Posters on 2008-09-23 18:13:55
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Neighborhood names, like the lines on the map they describe, are transient. Is this poster being created as a bookmark on the cityscape to reference this momentary demarkation, or is there a cutoff point in time where older names are given preference over newly-minted "hood" names? Some residents of Beacon Hill are campaigning to change the neighborhood's name to BeHi. That's silly. So is Sodo. I say visit county records and look at a real map instead of polling for these infinite divisions.

posted by mschwartz on 2008-09-23 18:29:14
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I would show the outline of greenlake itself.

The neighborhood directly south of the lake and north of Wallingford (bordered on the south by 50th) is Tangletown or Meridian (the former is a newer appellation)

posted by meks on 2008-09-23 18:40:22
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Seems to me that Denny Regrade is presently being pushed as Denny Triangle, with all the new green flags down there advertising the heck out of the neighborhood for the abundance of new condos...

Looks good though! I can't wait to get one :)

posted by figure8designs on 2008-09-23 18:59:46
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Unincorporated parts of King County still pay Seattle Utilities, and ARE within Seattle City Limits (Lakeridge, Bryn Mar). Also, who can't the south end get some larger font treatment? The whole city does simply live in Ballard, Capital Hill, Downtown and Freemont. Give some love.

posted by dsgnomite on 2008-09-23 19:14:09
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I can't wait to buy this poster! I've been jealous of the other ones.

posted by mizrobot on 2008-09-23 19:18:45
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Oooh! I'm so excited too! I wonder when it will be ready?

posted by L.C. on 2008-09-23 19:50:14
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I'm in West Seattle. I can't see (I'm getting old!) is Luna Park on there? I confess I think of it all as just West Seattle (including Delridge and Fauntleroy). And yeah -- where is White Center?

posted by DWF on 2008-09-23 19:54:00
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sooo excited! and about time too!

posted by jenniejenjen on 2008-09-23 20:37:57
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I am in Queen Anne, I think that this is very cool.

posted by mikelay on 2008-09-23 23:46:49
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Thank you for not including Bellevue or any of the islands.

posted by mikelay on 2008-09-23 23:48:38
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And I see they've bought into Paul Allen's marketing campaign, and we end up with no mention of the Cascade neighborhood.

posted by graphxgrrl on 2008-09-24 01:03:36
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Does anyone really use the Yesler Terrace moniker? I usually just call it the CD or ID & loosely use Boren Ave & Jackson as the border. Just curious about that one. And does MLK count as a neighborhood of sorts?

Also, Licton Springs? That's a brand spanking new one to this area native/10 year resident. Same goes for Hillman City.

Denny/Blaine is also new to me. I've never heard anyone refer to that neighborhood using that name--it's either Madison or Madrona. If I were to give someone directions using the Denny neighborhood name, they would probably end up in the Denny Regrade/Cascade/SLU area.

1 for adding an outline of actual Greenlake the lake for reference & adding White Center. Incorporated or not, White Center is considered part of West Seattle.

Ork--Cool poster! Thanks for reading my nitpicking. Seattle yelp has a talk thread about this that you may find helpful http://www.yelp.com/topic/seattle-weigh-in-on-the-seattle-neighborhood-poster

posted by akb on 2008-09-24 01:29:33
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You are braver than many to do a map of Seattle neighborhoods!

The boundaries are mutable and overlap, unlike other cities where the government designates the neighborhood boundaries.

It's a tough thing because there are historic neighborhoods, historic towns that were brought into Seattle, neighborhood associations with their ever changing territory (for example Madrona used to go up to 25th or 26th as recently as 10 years ago) , neighborhood planning areas, City of Seattle maps, descriptions on wikipedia (which while I disagree with how they organize the Central District and map it, they do have a good description of the issue of neighborhoods on their Seattle Neighborhoods page), and history link

What is considered the Central Area or Central District is an OVERLAY that consists of all of some neighborhoods and parts of others, as well as parts that were always just the Central District as those areas had no other name.

Here are a few suggestions. The Central Area includes Judkins and Madison Valley. It does not go very far south of I-90, if at all south of I90. Having some neighborhoods called out, including Madison Valley and Judkins and Garfield and Jackson Place, etc, might be ok with the rest left as the Central District, or overlay the Central District.

Madison Park does not cross the Arboretum. Your map is missing Madison Valley, which also considers itself part of the Central Area. BTW, Madison Valley was originally a farm owned by an early African American settler. Parts of Madrona and Leschi have also been part of the Central Area.

Here are some maps:

http://www.madrona.us/map.htm

http://madisonvalley.org/Online_Articles/Map.htm

http://www.ci.seattle.wa.us/commnty/CNA/about/map.htm

http://seattle.gov/neighborhoods/npi/maps/Central%20Area.pdf

Seattle Department of Neighborhoods
http://seattle.gov/neighborhoods/npi/plans.htm

Squire Park (which includes the historic area of Cherry Hill)
http://www.squirepark.org/the_neighborhood/

Good Luck!!

posted by kt in seattle on 2008-09-24 04:15:30
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Oh Mann (along with Cherry Hill) are historic.

Admittedly, many neighborhoods were named because someone built a subdivision. But, I worry about the idea of drawing boundaries. That is against the whole way Seattle organizes itself, even tho I would prefer things to be much more orderly myself.

Maybe just put dots or little flags at the epicenter of each neighborhood with the name and ditch the outlines. I colorize and throw in big institutions and parks....

posted by kt in seattle on 2008-09-24 04:24:24
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All the LAKES should be labeled too! The waters are a big part of live in Seattle.

And given all the house-boats and folks who live onboard, I think it's perfectly legit to consider them as neighborhoods.

On this map, we should at least show LAKE UNION, LAKE WASHINGTON, and ELLIOT BAY.

posted by binaryscape on 2008-09-24 05:00:55
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For West Seattle, I'd also include Admiral (SE of Alki, with beautiful views of the city) and the Junction (indie business hub of the neighborhood)... I was surprised to see Fauntleroy got separate billing, but these neighborhoods were lumped together!

Having lived in lower Queen Anne, I agree that upper QA and lower QA (sometimes referred to as 'Uptown') are two distinctly separate neighborhoods. I also lived on the QA side of Interbay, we fondly called it 'Quagnolia'... a homage to 'Frelard', the tongue-in-cheek nickname locals have for the area where Ballard becomes Fremont.

Very excited about this poster- please keep us posted on when it will become available!

posted by SeattleMama on 2008-09-24 05:44:25
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so if there are 40 of us willing to post about this why isnt there an ATSEA? who's with me!?

posted by abigalejane on 2008-09-24 12:58:44
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agreed! add the water and add atsea!

also, just put a big "CD" for central district.

posted by alisoncat on 2008-09-24 13:24:04
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I find it very strange that Northgate isn't on there. Everyone refers to that area (the main portion with the mall) as Northgate.

posted by uhanekai on 2008-09-24 18:13:11
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And I think it's odd to see 'Downtown' so small. Maybe it should just be labeled Business District? And just avoid the whole 'Downtown' theme all together unless you outline all the DT districts that incorporate as Downtown somehow.

posted by uhanekai on 2008-09-24 18:20:53
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As a West Seattlite, I just wanted to second the inclusion of White Center & Wedgewood. :)

posted by luxeandjacs on 2008-09-25 16:58:50
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It would be good to include a couple of neighborhoods for West Seattle: Admiral (and potentially North Admiral), and possibly Luna Park.

On Capitol Hill, I would call out Pike/Pine.

There are other things that previous readers have mentioned that I would definitely agree with: the distinction between Upper and Lower Queen Anne is important. A portion of South Lake Union is now being called Cascade. Minor and Mann is the "Central District" or "The CD".

The East side of the University District is often called University Village.

Definitely label the water.

posted by greggers on 2008-09-27 11:08:41
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"Pike Market"? Really? NO ONE SAYS THAT. except out-of-towners. People call it Pike Place or The Market. Also, it's not a neighborhood - no one talks about the Pike Place Market neighborhood. It's an area within downtown. - demolitionwoman

I agree that no one calls it "Pike Market," but it is a distinct (albeit small) neighborhood of about 500 people, many of whom work there as well. They also offer low-income and elderly/disabled housing, and have their own community foundation. I think it's a unique neighborhood that deserves its own recognition.

1. akb is right that New Holly is housing development designation that is not used by real people. - meks

It's true that NewHolly is a new housing development, so probably doesn't seem like a "real" neighborhood to those of us who have been here for awhile (or forever). (Yes, NewHolly is spelled without a space, and yes, I find that obnoxious.) However, I think NewHolly is a neighborhood in its own right. The people I know from that area are refugees and immigrants (very real people, and a significant portion of Seattle's population), and when you ask them where in Seattle they live, they reply "NewHolly."

It might not be a traditional Seattle neighborhood with a long history, but it is a consciously planned community that embodies a lot of proclaimed Seattle values, like diversity, access to education for everyone, safe gathering places for children and teens, and support for disadvantaged populations. I've actually been really interested to see what will happen to this neighborhood over the next 10-15 years. If whatever money is funding the community services and low-income housing keeps flowing, it could turn into a really vibrant place (and it already is from what I saw when I was teaching there). But I always think of things like the "projects" in other cities - if the funding for social support is cut off in a community where the majority of the residents are disadvantaged in some way (elderly, poverty, refugee, etc.), what will happen?

Check out http://www.seattlehousing.org/Development/newholly/newholly.html for more information.

posted by sausolito22 on 2008-10-15 15:34:39
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