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this vase looks like the blob in the AT logo.

That vase is to small to be used as a fishbowl. Although it looks cool (but that's just the vase ;) ) , this is cruelty to animals imho.

Animals are NOT decor items, or accessories. This is really cruel looking.

unfortunately people have a misconception that bettas need only a very very small amount of water. this is not true and i wish that people that owned any sort of pet would do their research first (and listening to the pet store does NOT count).

cruel... what a horrible way to keep a fish.

I don't have the best eye for perspective, but that doesn't look like nearly enough water for a betta. http://www.nippyfish.net/choosingatank.html

uhm... yeah... betta fish live in little puddles in nature. this vase is MUCH larger than the pools of water they're sold in.

From the above link:

"While it is true that bettas in the wild live in rice paddies in Thailand and other parts of Asia, the perception of this habitat is grossly underrated. While these rice paddies may dry up to just a few inches deep they are part of an overall very large body of water that consists of a complete ecosystem. It takes a good amount of work to recreate an ecosystem in a tank and its never as good as nature intended.

Remember too, that the bettas we keep in our homes come from generations of domestic stock and are very different from their wild cousins. The next time you hear that bettas should be kept in a small bowl, know that it is simply not true. The smallest acceptable tank size for a Betta splenden is one gallon and this minimum is not recommended. About 2.5 gal and up is much better for your fish. "

Sorry for the posting spree, but just one more point: many animals can survive for days without food, but would you only feed your dog or cat a few times a week? Just because a fish *can* survive in a few inches of water doesn't mean a pet should be kept that way.

Cruel, but pretty.

Better Bombshell - The major reason that this tank size is recommended is because it is better for regulating temperature. Betta's do best in a temp of no less than 75 Fahrenheit.

No matter what, a tank ISN'T going to replicate the natural ecosystem of a betta. Anyone who feels that this is cruel, but owns a pet while living in an apartment, is hypocritical.
I have a cat in my apartment, I keep her indoors, and I bet many of you do, too. Our cats would roam MUCH further if they lived outdoors, we keep them restricted to a smaller-than-natural space. Some of us even take pictures of them sitting on our sheepskin rugs and sleeping on our MCM chairs. That doesn't make us bad pet parents.

I think this is closer to keeping a cat in a bathroom or walk in closet.

Cool (looking) but cruel.

based on the size of the fish compared to its natural and captive habitats... no, not really.

How about keeping a cat in a small studio or jr. 1 bedroom apt.? Which I am sure ATers (self included) do or have done. (My upstairs neighbor in my last apartment had two cats, three birds, a rat, and a pit bull in her 350 sq. ft. apartment [she's in vet school now].)

That said, I too think this looks too small for a fish, but it sure is pretty.

I have had Betta's as pets for years. In addition to the comments already posted I'd like to add that its only a matter of time before that little guy jumps out of that vase.

It's unfortunate that people think that bettas live in little puddles in nature. They live in rice paddies. There is a difference.

Why why WHY is fish abuse so damn popular? That fish is alive, it's not a decoration, and it needs much more room to live happily and healthfully. Shame on you for promoting this, Apartmenttherapy!

The Living Conditions section in Wikipedia has some good information about tanks and decor http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siamese_fighting_fish.

I like it and fish are delicious.

closertotheocean--While you are right that the rice paddy puddles are only a few inches deep, the actual body of water can be hundreds of miles long. Unless you are next going to try and argue that they make hundred mile long fish tanks, I think your point is quite moot.

quite the contrary, pileofkittens. what i'm saying is that the DON'T make hundred mile long fish tanks. no fish tank is ever going to be the size of the fish's natural habitat.

just like no studio apartment or mansion is ever going to be the size of a cat's natural habitat.

yet many of us, myself, and i'm assuming you included, own cats, and keep them in a smaller-than-natural space.

so is the tank smaller than the fish's natural habitat? YES, of COURSE. however, i think the small size is really accentuated by the small size of the animal we're talking about. we're willing to hugely restrict where our cats can go, so why shouldn't we apply the same to fish? i'm not saying it is right or wrong. but i personally have no grievances with keeping my cat indoors, thus apply the same logic to having a fish in a tank. i'm just encouraging people to think about it that way, rather than jump all over this as cruel.

Everyone who is posting negative things about the size of this betta bowl should remember this next time they order sushi...

LOVE! LOVE! LOVE!

Well the cactus look great!

So take any fish out of the ocean and you can't put it into an ocean-sized tank you're cruel. OKAYGOTITNOPETSFORANYONE.

I do enjoy the terrarium, but my goodness that would be pricey. :)

Tank size isn't just for the fish's roaming comfort. The nitrate and pH levels can get too high in small amounts of water and poison the fish. Bettas do ok in brackish water, but you'd still have to clean this tank almost everyday.

This goldfish bowl would is banned in Rome (counts as spherical to me): http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article583028.ece

would be / is banned

TiffanyH -

Agreed. :)

I loooove this used as a terranium. Also, I feel like Target had a knock-off of this vase a while back, for anyone who's interested.

I THINK THE FISH TANK IS FAAAAAAAANTASTIC!

I also think people who complain about posts on AT should 1st have to submit a photo of their own home.
Dare you.

Are the Savoy vases expensive? I have a little one that I got for $2 at a Salvation Army that I guess didn't know any better. I would love to get a larger one some day.

woah! is that spam above my post?

march3rd strikes again.... oi.

"Everyone who is posting negative things about the size of this betta bowl should remember this next time they order sushi..."

That's actually a very good point. I don't see why people who don't care about animals used for foods (which, more often then not, are treated very poorly) get so up in arms when it comes to animals kept as pets. Is there a huge difference between that salmon on your plate and that fish in your tank?

I'm a vegan, having come to the conclusion that animals shouldn't be treated poorly. But if you are unable, by your own logic, to come to the same conclusion, isn't it reasonable to say that you shouldn't care so much about how pets are treated? It's a cop-out to only care about maltreatment when it's sitting in front of you.

The way I see it, if you're still eating animal products that don't come from cruelty free sources (which are very hard to verify), then you really have no leg to stand on. It's akin to a someone who abuses their child criticizing another parent's disciplinary techniques.

I like the idea, but I hate to see a little fish all alone in a bowl. Would be super cool if a tank manufacturer took the concept and made it into a larger tank. let those little fishies swim and have some friends

haha fly. Yeah the succulents, right on!!! woo!

Interesting reasoning.

I have a small apartment and a cat. Bad me. Therefore I should have no qualms about keeping a fish in a tiny bowl, nor should I open my mouth to protest that it's cruel.

I mean, it's already clear that I'm a terrible person for doing that to my cat. Why not just go whole hog, as it were. Gee, I could even open my own vivisection lab, it's clearly just the same as having a cat in an urban apartment. Morally I mean.

Since I eat products that may not come from cruelty free sources, that further undermines my ability to speak out about mistreatment.

Let's see where this line of thought goes... I hate ants, and kill them in my house. Therefore I should be able to kill anything or anyONE that I wish. I'm a killer, right?

Differences do matter. You may look down on me because I am not a vegan with plastic shoes, but don't tell me I've wholly abdicated all sense of right and wrong because I occasionally eat animal products, or have a cat and don't live in a palace, with an adjacent forest.

My boyfriend once had one of these fish in a bowl with some lucky bamboo coming out the top. It was really cute. Then my cat knocked it over and ate it, everything. Oh well, circle of life. Hey, do you people work for peta or something? Geez, settle down.

ElleBee... I'm sorry to have offended you, but you missed the point. I have a cat in an apartment, too. I'm saying it ISN'T bad. I don't think you are doing ANYTHING wrong by having a cat restricted to a smaller area. I'm saying that anyone who has a cat you and ME included, shouldn't be upset about a fish living in a bowl. Please reread my previous post. I'm really saying that we're not doing anything wrong, but that keeping a cat in an apartment is relative to keeping a fish in a bowl. We can't give them a habitat nearly as large as their natural one, but we sure as heck can care for them and give them a good life.

You didn't offend me. I'm comfortable with my choices. I did read your post, but I'm not sure you read mine. Your reasoning is flawed. Just because you do something incrementally sub-optimal is no rationale for throwing out all responsibility for acting in a reasonable, moral manner.

PS Was also trying to address Evello's comments, not just yours.

Oh please.

I agree that fish should be kept in heated tanks with filtration. But this fish DOES have room to move around, to actually swim. It's actually the owner's loss, because betta fish are VERY active when given a larger area to swim in. People here are acting like it's still in a cup at the fish store. If the owner does a partial water change every day, and cleans the rocks, etc., he will be fine.

i agree. i would LOVE to have a large clean minimalist cylindrical vase with a goldfish, but it's simply not feasible. i'm no animal rights activist, but i'm not going to put stress on an animal because i want an aquarium.

it would be awesome if someone could create a self contained under gravel filter/aerator without visible tubes, mechanics, etc. to keep a fish healthy and happy in a smaller aquarium.

until then... i'll be happy with my moss terrarium.

The bowl isn't that small, is it? We have one in our office and it looks plenty big for one beta.

Look, it's not feasible for most people to get a larger apartment or a big house just so their cat can have more room. So they compromise, with cat trees or just lots of playing. But anybody has the space for a 1 or 2 gallon tank to give the betta enough room to display its wonderful personality, which changes dramatically when they're moved out of a tiny bowl.

The reason tiny bowls "look plenty big" is that we're used to seeing tanks that are way overstocked. The aquariums you see at the pet store, or in restaurants, have way too many fish to sustain either decent water quality or normal fish behavior. They don't care, because the restaurants are using them for decoration and the pet stores are just trying to sell the fish. The packaging for a small aquarium always shows it with 3-5 times the actual appropriate number of fish.

bigcityboy2, bettas shouldn't be kept in big tanks with other fish. They can harass smaller fish, or they can be harassed by bigger ones, and those long fins tend to get caught in the filtration systems needed for a larger tank. Some people make it work, but there's just no predicting. They do best alone.

As a final note, partial water changes are not appropriate for an unfiltered bowl, because without a filter it's not going to develop a stable nitrate cycle to take care of the ammonia. The water should be changed completely.

OK all the talk about bettas is fine; I like a good argument. But "I like it and fish are delicious"? That's hilarious. Best post in the thread.

Thousands of years ago, man would roam hundreds of miles throughout the course of his lifetime as a hunter-gatherer.

Now, we're fine in 250 sq.-ft. apartments.

Is that cruel?

I don't think it's wrong to keep a betta in a bowl, providing it has the space to swim a bit, and livable water conditions . We don't assume a single parent who lives with his or her child in a 250sq apartment is cruel. And really, that child has no more "choice" in where he or she lives than the betta. (Also, keep in mind that people in other countries often have much, much less space.) I've seen bettas live upwards of five years in bowls of comparable size, with no sign of disease, ill health, stress, etc.

Humans and bettas both originally enjoyed much more space than we sometimes do now. But who's to say we aren't both fine with smaller spaces, as long as they've got a bit of room to move around in and are well-maintained?

Isn't that what this site is all about??

Fish must be so bored.

"Differences do matter. You may look down on me because I am not a vegan with plastic shoes, but don't tell me I've wholly abdicated all sense of right and wrong because I occasionally eat animal products, or have a cat and don't live in a palace, with an adjacent forest."

Wait, so it's not okay for me, a vegan, to look down on you, but it's okay for you, someone who financially supports animal cruelty, to look down on the owner of this fish?

Again, this is akin to someone who abuses their child criticizing another parent's disciplinary techniques. Yes, that parent may be using bad disciplinary techniques, may have raised a spoiled brat because they don't discipline at all, but to have the full on out child abuser criticize them for that? It's just ironic.

We live in a society where people do not value the lives of animals. We occasionally make exceptions for animals kept as pets, but is that logical? Furthermore, is a fish really on the same level as a dog? Why would you expect someone to have a large tank for a pet fish when you yourself may very well consume fish that was raised in a horrible environment? Is the fish's status as pet what makes it worthy of deserving good living conditions? Is that distinction alone all that matters to you?

I'm not one for religion, but this passage from the Bible rings true here. "First remove the beam from your own eye, and then you will see clearly enough to remove the speck from your brother's eye." -Matthew 7:5


And despite being a vegan, I wasn't going to comment on the small size of this vase as a fish bowl, I was going to complement the terrarium. I've been able to realize that as long as our society doesn't value animal life, I can't expect people to care. Why should I expect them not to keep a fish in a small bowl when they consume animal products? And really, shouldn't everyone be left alone to live as they please?

Blatant animal abuse will always be something I'll object to, but keeping a fish in a small bowl or a cat in a small apartment doesn't warrant it. If making a fuss over something as insignificant as this makes you feel better, then please carry on. Just keep in mind that, on a whole, you are doing very little to stop animal cruelty.

Why use this vase as a fishbowl, where it'll get slime all over it or a terrarium, and let the glass get etched? It's a beautiful object. You don't need to prove how kr8tive you are by mauling it into some freakish use.

"And really, shouldn't everyone be left alone to live as they please?"
Charles Manson and Hitler surely would have loved your logic, Evello.

It's also just a thing, Palmetto. If you want to fill it with ice cream or q-tips or baseball cards, it would be ok.

I think you're missing the point, plus adding in inflammatory comments (the child abuse comparison = straw man argument) and sanctimonious attitudes (argumentum ad hominem). You're a vegan and talk about society's poor treatment of animals but think changing a long-held, damaging stereotype, in this case fishbowls, is insignificant? Interesting.

I say again, small differences do matter. Thank for giving me the permission to carry on, or "fuss" if you will, even though it obviously doesn't make any difference, and will only serve to make pathetic little me feel better.

I will also, while I'm at it, continue to recycle my glass bottles, bring a cloth bag to the grocery store, cut down on buying plastics, and so on. Not that that matters either.

"Thousands of years ago, man would roam hundreds of miles throughout the course of his lifetime as a hunter-gatherer."

Now man argues over fish in a bowl.

closertotheocean-There's a giant difference between a cat living in a small space and a fish living in a small space, I'm not sure how you can possibly think that they are correlated. A fish can only survive based on the oxygen levels within their environment, while a cat has unlimited amounts of air to breathe no matter where they are located. Fish also give off their wastes into their own environment, so failing to clean such a small vase several times a day will leave a buildup of excrement which burns off the fish's scales slowly. A cat does not live in its own filth, does not have to face losing its own skin or having its organs shut down one by one due to swallowing its own fecal matter.

amusememusically- once again, due to the argument above, there's really no comparison between a fish living in a tiny bowl and being forced to consume its own excrement and a human living in a small space with plenty of oxygen and a separate place to go to the bathroom. Why don't people seem to get this?

Also, people who live in small apartments and their children often also roam the earth to work and school and shopping and playing and just roaming.

I guess I'm not someone who is interested in keeping fish. To me, a pet is a pet, and a fishtank is something you can't really hug. I don't know why people keep fish, or how they choose fish to keep. Exotic, colorful, sometimes the same way they choose their dog, but also how they choose their plants, and maybe their clothes and furniture. Except nobody ever just finds a fish and takes it home. Well maybe they catch some lobsters or eels at the market and set them free, but nobody ever says I can give the lobster a nicer home, he'll be so happy and safe.

On the other hand, people choose plants, expensive or cheap, maybe trade seeds, or share cuttings, or plant an apple in the yard and see what happens. That's just not for me, but I can see how someone might find this a happy thing, a decorative thing, a hobby, or a nourishment to themselves. Do plants feel exploited? A recent AT article suggests maybe! but most would tend to be skeptical because (a) just because and (b) one more thing to worry about. Clothes and stuff can be borrowed or bought, or very couture or thrift store looking or rags. People look how they want to look for the most part and the clothes don't care. Same with their interior style.

I just don't "get" fish. They're relaxing to look at. Put them in a vase, and no matter what anyone says, that's a decoration. You've just used your fish for decoration. I don't say you're inherently going to be unokay with that, but don't dispute the observation.

Bettas are feisty little guys with lots of personality. They recognize their owners and come over to say hello (and beg for food). In a gently aerated tank, they will "bubble surf," which is hysterical. Sometimes they'll hide and ambush you.

None of those behaviors come out when you keep them in a tiny bowl, which is why people think they're just decoration.

(And I do know "betta rescuers" who run across sad-looking, torn-finned bettas in those awful blue-water cups and take them home and give them their own little tank.)

Nuni, how is this cruel looking? How different is this from a fish bowl?

BTW, everyone should check March3rd's profile. It's hilarious!

March3rd, can you recommend a website for modern sofas?

"And really, shouldn't everyone be left alone to live as they please?
Charles Manson and Hitler surely would have loved your logic, Evello."

YAY GODWIN'S LAW!! : )
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

Fish is suffering for art!

ElleBee,
You're making sense. Some of the people posting here (sadly), just don't get it. Maybe Joel didn't know that betta fish need more water. I myself have mostly seen betta fish in tiny tanks and honestly never thought anything of it because it looks "normal." How sad.

pileofkittens- yeah, because there's no fish excrement at all in the oceans, lakes, or puddles fish live in...

As far as being "forced to consume its own excrement," keep in mind that dogs do this for fun :D In order to dutifully recreate the sort of environment that this fish probably encounters in nature, the water will have to be a lot less pristine than it looks here. It's like comparing a swimming pool to a pond. Think maggots, stagnation, parasites, PREDATORS.... are you sure this betta has it so bad?

Because the ocean with its trillions of gallons of water is the exact same thing as a liter-sized bowl. Gotcha.

This whole freak-out and knickers-in-twist debate is too bizarre to even comment on; it's a fish, in a bowl that is likely bigger than what most betas are kept in...although I do think "I like it and fish are delicious" is about the most sane and calm comment on here...except for evello's

elleebee seems unable or unwilling to engage in linear reasoning and proceeds straight to an over-the-top histrionic response r/t the whole hypocrisy thread. Must be friends with Ingrid newkirk

Will someone please think of the fish?!

This thread represents everything that's embarrassing and wrong about San Francisco.

Must be that time again - a feature with a fish in some "cool" tiny, unsuitable vase (or hang on the wall vase) gets posted on Apartment Therapy, what, every three months or so?

Aalto is turning in his grave.

Unless you're a strict vegeterian please don't debate this is cruel because it's hypocrisy to say the least.