apartment therapy changing the world, one room at a time

eat lower on the food chain! (includes more vegetarian/vegan, but also just less processed stuff shipped from a million miles away).

You mentioned, walking, public transit, and even hybrid cars, but you forgot bicycling! As an added bonus, it's healthy (so is walking), and more fun than all the other options you mentioned.

There's nothing "green" about a Prius.

the enegery it takes to build one and keep it on the road is more than it takes to drive a HUMMER.

The *real* MPG of a Prius is around 40 or so with the new test methodology that uses real world driving conditions.

The batteries in the Prius use materials from a site so toxic it's completely devoid of life and used by NASA to test moon rovers. The acid rain from the mining operation is some of the worst in the western hemisphere.

Prius, the magic hybrid. Gotta love marketing hype.

boomer, I was very curious about your Prius/Hummer-related statements, so I began looking for cites to confirm for myself.

Might your statements be linked to the CNW Marketing Research firm's report? The veracity of those claims is being quibbled in a few places:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/06/04/EDGI7Q63U01.DTL
http://www.engadget.com/2007/03/24/questionable-report-claims-hummer-is-greener-than-prius/
http://www.thecarconnection.com/Auto_News/Green_Car_News/Prius_Versus_HUMMER_Exploding_the_Myth.S196.A12220.html

and so on.

I have a pretty open mind about the impact of either car -- I just want to see cites behind some of these statements, that's all.

Even if it ran off a stack of conventional lead-acid batteries rather than the Toyota super stack it's still not a good use of money or for the environment.

Considering all the toxic materials that go into making the extra batteries, and the fact that you can get cars with good gas mileage for half the price of a Prius.

CNW report or not, the thing is neither "green" nor a sensible buy. In my opinion. (as if I needed to say that part ;->).

I've test driven them, I almost bought one a couple of years ago. In the end it was just too much of a gutless wonder for the money. To get the thing up to 55 from a stop sign (expressway driving) I felt like the poor hamster under the hood would explode or something. To get it up to freeway speeds (70-80) was really pushing it.

Now when hydrogen based cars come on the market then I'll be excited about green cars. Also when hydrogen fuel becomes practical we *might* see practical Jetson style hover cars assuming someone can make practical superconductive cavities that work at liquid hydrogen temperatures. And assuming Shawyer's theory isn't "a load of rubbish".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EmDrive

By the way, did you know there's a guy in India who invented a practical car running on *compressed air*?! Now that's green. If it works. I know next to nothing about it except that it's supposed to be possible.

http://www.theaircar.com/

Stop getting take-out drinks in throw-away containers. Use your own mug/glass/bottle

I'll add...

* buying compact fluorescent bulbs and, contrary to the concept that they cost a lot of money, PG&E-sponsored bulbs are available at many "dollar stores" for, yup, $1 each

* become a locavore (eating within a 100-mile radius of where you live, to help reduce transportation pollution, and eat more organic, to help reduce the volume of chemical use):
http://www.locavores.com/
and a San Francisco Chronicle article from April 18, 2007
http://tinyurl.com/25bqmg

* skip the dry cleaner, or switch to a greener dry cleaner, and buy clothing you can maintain at home whenever possible

* use soap nuts to do your laundry rather than chemical detergents

* capture your gray water for reuse in your landscape (dishwashing rinse, shower 'warm up', laundry rinse)

* unplug chargers and appliances when not in use (many continue to draw unneeded power simply because they're plugged in)

* light the area you're working in, in your home, but leave the rest of the lights and appliances off (and I recently got rid of my TV, which I realized I was just using mostly as 'background noise')

* if you can't install a low-flow toilet, and have the old style, add a water-filled 'float' (soda pop bottle works fine) to help take up some of the water tank space to reduce water consumption

It can be fun looking for ways to minimize your impact, it's like a big puzzle or scavenger hunt, get the kids involved and give rewards for creative ideas.

Turn off (hibernate) your desktop PC when not in use. Like when you're watching TV or walking the dog. That will save more energy and money than not using a TV for lighting/background noise.


As to CF bulbs, they contain enough mercury that when they start being disposed of by millions of people they will be an ecological time bomb.

For example according to even GE, who makes the bulbs, you don't just throw them away. They need to be tied in a separate plastic bag. So by encouraging CF use you're adding millions of plastic bags to landfills. NOT green.

GE says you need to know if your garbage goes to an incinerator - as CF bulbs should never be incinerated (toxic gas release).

You can't dim CF bulbs. The few that are compatible with dimmers do not actually dim (speaking from personal experience).

CF bulbs can not be used with most timers (possibly due to back-EMF but I'm not sure on that one).

CF bulbs should only be used in applications were their "on time" will exceed 15 minutes. Or the life span will be shortened significantly.

All this is in the FAQ on the GE website (google it).

buy things with less packaging, or packaging that can be recycled. choose cans and glass bottles over plastic whenever possible, as they are less resource-intensive to recycle.

most of all, do what feels right and do what works for you. in my experience (as a 20 year vegetarian/vegan), the people who most boisterously say you are not doing enough (or not doing the "right" things) are the ones who are not actually doing anything at all.

Aquarabbit -

You wouldn't be talking about Al Gore with his fleet of gas guzzlers, private yacht, private jets and 3 30" monitors on his desk all in use at the same time would you? Oh and the fact that he buys "carbon credits"? The money goes to his own company.

So when Al Gore says "everyone has to cut back except for me", I have to seriously wonder why. And no, I don't think he has the interest of the panet in mind or he would be eating his own dog food (so to speak).

Compared to Al Gore, we're all green!!! ;->

Seriously though, I hibernate my PC when it's not in use. And I drive in the carpool lane (alone) to save energy by not needlessly idling my car.

I drive in the carpool lane as well, but pick up passengers from casual carpool. The added benefit is that you get an opportunity to meet the people who live in your community.

I wholeheartedly agree with aquarabbit's suggestions re: eating lower on the food chain and doing what you can and where you can.

Boomer you're selectively picking information and I wonder if it's a deliberate attempt to be alarmist, a broken bulb is one thing (as is a broken mercury thermometer), but the offsets between CF and power plants is huge making CF's a worthwhile use in the home. CF recycling is now widely available, and how often does one break a lightbulb or thermometer in one's home, not very often.

The inaccurate comments about Gore could have been left out entirely as they read like a partisan-TV news flash. I've read up on what he's doing so I know I have an accurate non-partisan view (and I'm truly Independent).

Suggestions, without being snarky, would be appreciated. Seriously let's make sure this remains a productive thread.

Actually, Rucy, I'm not "selectively" picking information.

I think Al Gore is a fraud and I don't think CF bulbs are good for the environment.

Those are personal opinions. Nothing snarky about them.

Nothing snarky about calling someone a fraud?

Use a timer in the shower if you usually take more than 4 or 5 minutes.

Make sure your home is properly insulated so that your heating/cooling isn't wasted.

If you've got a choice between two fairly equal products, choose the one with less packaging - you're only going to chuck the plastic wraps in the bin anyway.

It's got to be possible to think (and say) that someone is a fraud without being snarky, right, v in boston?

That said, I adore Al Gore and everything he stands for - always have. I'm grateful for everything he's working for. Of course one could criticize this or that relatively small thing, but his net effect seems hugely beneficial.

Eat locally grown foods as much as you can... You get fresh, tasty products and it is great for your local economy as well.