Q: I'm looking into moving to San Francisco within the next couple of years and honestly, I have no idea where to start! I was wondering if your readers could give me some tips on where the best places to find an apartment right in the city are, and how much I can expect to pay for a studio or one bedroom apartment.
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Comments (38)
This is a HUGE question and depends a lot on what you value in a neighborhood. After living in the inner Richmond, usf panhandle and Hayes valley I would recommend Hayes valley. It's smack in the middle of the city, freeway is right there in case you commute and the blue bottle coffee stand will soon become something you can't live without.
Wouldn't it make more sense to be asking this question as you get closer to your move in date? If you're moving in a few years, I wouldn't get attached to a neighborhood now... Neighborhoods are constantly changing. This question is silly.
Information like a budget, place of work, and lifestyle priorities (near public transit, lots of restaurants, easy access to bike trails, good schools, etc., etc.) would be helpful. SF is such a huge and diverse city, that unless you provide more details, it'll be difficult to give suggestions.
And don't forget the fog! Everyone has an opinion about which neighborhoods get the least fog -- I always found it very amusing! Bottom line -- the closer to the Pacific you are, the more fog you will get.
I lived in San Francisco for 6 years, and I can say some of the best neighborhoods are West Portal, Upper Haight, Noe Valley, Hayes Valley, Little Italy/North Beach and Pacific Heights. Much like New York or any metropolis, the city is divided in to little sectors. Public transportation is amazing so depending where you need to go for work etc... you should consider the major surrounding bus lines.
There is a rental company that helps you find listings and they are very resourceful (and often less sketchy as Craigslist) they are called Metro Rent, located in Pacific Heights. Very helpful, I found almost all my apts in SF through them.
Rent in SF now is still pretty steep as it is one of the more pricier cities- studios are anywhere between $900-1200, 1 br run around $1300-1800 depending on the neighborhood you live in.
As you get closer to moving to SF I say plan a long weekend and really do the ground work. Spend time in various neighborhoods at different times of days. Also if you have an idea of what kind of work you'll be doing there... probably good to find out where your office will be located.
Hope that is somewhat helpful.
Agree with herglasslegs...Based on the way you phrased your question...moving "within the next couple years" w/ no detail about your lifestyle...this question is a.) impossible to answer and b.) I don't actually think you'll ever move. but look at me being all surly in the morning.
Hey, I've been "going to move to San Francisco this year" for the last two. Selling a house sucks right now.
Anyways, here are three websites that should help her figure out what neighborhood fits her best:
http://nabewise.com/sf
http://www.lubasf.com/blog/whats-the-right-san-francisco-neighborhood-for-you.php
http://www.7x7.com/arts/7-best-neighborhoods-san-francisco
One more: http://www.zephyrsf.com/agent/luba-muzichenko/buy/explore-neighborhoods
I disagree, this question is all to important when considering moving to SF!! I admire your planning skills and I do hope you move there! I lived in SF for almost 6 years myself and the neighborhood you call home can really make or break you! Hayes Valley is a great area, but be prepared to pay for it just like any other nice area of the city. You could also look into Nob Hill for localized living and cute studios, Upper Haight is also great, North Beach! BEWARE of the "helping"
hands of metro rent and citi apartments, you pay WAY more and they only help you with their rental properties which makes the prices sky rocket! Shop around...A LOT. No one has really addressed the area of costs....I agree this part will change in the upward direction, but be prepared for a "nice" studio to be around $1,200 + and 1 bdrms are going to be almost $2,000 in the neighborhoods that have been suggested. If you can handle a little grime, some areas of the mission and tender-nob are do-able, but just KNOW the area. You cross over one block and the world shifts. Also, do NOT second hand shop for furniture....can you say bed bug land (also the Marina/cow hollow is just infested with these little boogers)!! Good luck!
Budget, lifestyle, and timing are important factors. When I moved to San Francisco in 2007, the rental market was at its peak: studios in good parts of the city were over $1,000 and 1 bedrooms were over $1,500. By the time I left in 2010, the rental market had slowed, and studios were going for about $850, 1 bedrooms closer to $1350. Not a big difference, but just an example of how timing is important.
In terms of neighborhoods, SF has something for everyone. The only way to "know" which neighborhood to live in is to go there for awhile (I'd say at least a week), and just walk around different neighborhoods. Try getting to and from places on public transit and find which neighborhoods offer the best vibe, ease of transit, and preferred terrain. Some people love the hills of Nob Hill, some prefer the flatlands of the Sunset or Richmond. Some people love the subway, so it is imperative to live near a subway stop, some people love the bus, so a good bus line is important. Go to SF, walk around, find what feels right.
All that being said, I lived in Duboce Triangle for the entirety of my SF experience, and I loved it. Not a single complaint. Safe, clean, central to all the Muni lines and close enough to BART. Good access to grocery stores and the freeway. It has a perfect SF mix of gay, straight, young, old, wealthy & not. There are hills but nothing out of control. It is almost the geographic center of the city, so no other part of the city is too far away.
Good luck - SF is a beautiful, wonderful place.
I just moved out of San Francisco 2 months ago. I loved it there, and you will too! Don't listen to the grumpy comments above - it's great that you're doing research in advance.
One really good way to get to know differing neighborhood personalities is to start reading hyper-local blogs. There are a lot of them in SF, some of the most active being (Mission Mission), Haighteration, and Bernalwood. There are also a lot of neighborhood associations, which a quick google can help get information on. If you really want a reality check, you can check out Curbed SF, a blog mostly about real estate in the various SF neighborhoods. Last but not least, SFist is one of the most active (and in my opinion one of the most entertaining) -ists. Hope these help!
When and if you decide to move to SF, my advice is to get a sublet on craigslist and then take your time exploring the neighborhoods in person. I'm not sure your age, occupation, etc. so really can't help you decide on a neighborhood. I've lived in Hayes Valley (before it was hip - rent was cheap), Nob Hill (nice studio, easy commute to the Financial District), Western Addition (now NoPa?) (nice, but nothing special), Cole Valley/Upper Haight (quiet, family-oriented, but near shops and Golden Gate Park), Inner Richmond (bought house. Quiet, good schools, near GGP and transportation.) Oh, and my general finding is that a bedroom starts at about $1000. A studio/1 bedroom is +/- $1000, 2 bedroom is $2000, etc. Good luck!
I love SOMA, right near the Embarcadero. We had a fabulous studio for 15 months at Howard and Embarcadero. You are close to muni, BART, CalTrain, and downtown. Grocery stores within walking distance, Ferry Building farmer's market two days a week, and more restaurants than you can ever get to.
Our studio (527 sq ft) was $1884 but was increasing to $2440 in March. $375 for parking. I figured I could better use my money so we returned to our home in Fresno that is paid for. We call our 15 month stay in SF our year of magical living.
The first thing you do is look for a job here - There's no point in asking what neighborhood you want to live in until you have a solid job offer in writing - and moving here without a job (or a trust fund) is utter foolishness as this place is nearly as expensive as New York City.
Don't expect to be able to afford a spacious apartment all to yourself in a modern/updated building located a sunny neighborhood on less than $60,000 a year - and that's stretching it. Folks who earn less than that and want a decent place to live can typically expect to have roommates or live in a walkup studio in an older building.
Also: If you have a car, either plan on selling it before you move here or as soon as you get here, as the parking spaces rent separately from apartments and can cost $200/month or more...
...otherwise you'll easily spend that much on parking tickets, repairs for break-ins and gouged bumpers, higher insurance rates, and excess gas driving around endlessly looking for street parking.
I would definitely start with craigslist.org. Enter your max price and check the images. Try to find cross streets and then look on Google Maps to get a bit more of an idea of the street/neighborhood. SF is very unique. No 2 properties are alike.
On CL,
remember to search "San Francisco" so you do not get other bay area towns that are nearby but not IN the city itself (ie south bay, east bay etc.)
As to the neighborhood, well that is a very personal choice. Depending on where you are working, you may want a place nearby or with easy access to commuting busses or cable cars. Or, if you are twenty-something, then you may want to be in a neighborhood that is easily walkable and has cafes, bars etc. There are the well known "unsafe" neighborhoods in the city, but then again, SF is metropolitan and every block is different. You can literally find million dollar homes on one street and then some housing projects just a couple blocks away.
Another GREAT blog to check out is http://thefrontsteps.com/ It is written by Alex Clark, a Realtor in SF who is very good friends with the above listed Realtor (Luba Muzichenko.) On Alex's blog, scroll down to the bottom right and check out the "Tour de SF." You can click on different neighborhoods in the city that Alex has written about. It's pretty informative.
Good luck!
I was born and raised in San Francisco, and I've lived in the following neighborhoods:
Inner Sunset
Outer Sunset
Glen Park
Nob Hill
Noe Valley
Montery Heights
I've worked in these neighborhoods:
Patrician (between Mission and Potrero Hill, but not really SOMA)
Downtown
Castro
I've had friends who live in these neighborhoods:
Russian Hill
Richmond
North Beach
Bernal Heights
Mission
Potrero Hill
Telegraph Hill
Twin Peaks
Diamond Heights
Upper Market
West Portal
Robin Williams has a home in Pacific Heights.
I love also love the neighborhood above the Haight that I can't remember the name for right at this moment... the homes are gorgeous.
I like parts of the Richmond that are near the park or the other side that are near the Presidio.
To everyone's point, if money is no object, it's just a matter of what kind of local area you like, and what kind of weather you like.
I don't live in SF anymore, but if I could choose to buy a home in SF, I think I would pick North Beach for that all encompassing San Francisco feel and access to night life, but it would have to be a home with a garage because parking is impossible. Literally. No joke.
I also absolutely love Glen Park for it's sunshine, freeway, and BART access and it's out the way, tucked into a canyon, village feel. Noe Valley has that feel too, but if I were in Noe Valley, I think I'd prefer to be over by the Castro rather than down by the Mission (Noe Valley borders Glen Park, too).
Rent? Expect to pay $1500-$2000 for a downtown studio, maybe $600-$1000 for share rental, depending on whether you rent a closet-cum-bedroom with 5 people or a 1/3 of a flat with 2.
Honestly, it depends on if you have a car. If not there are many options. Look for a list that describes the people in the neighborhoods. For example: Marina = douche. Haight = hippies (also no cell reception) North Beach = college. Stay away from downtown/tenderloin/soma. I would say choose a location in the city and work with the neighborhoods around it.
I lived in San Francisco for about 12 years; moved there to attend USF and just stayed after graduation. I think I changed apartments about every 2 years or so. All apartments found via Craigslist. The Outer Sunset district is definitely the most affordable (had a 2-bdrm in-law for $1000 per month) but so very far from the city center, even if you're close to a Muni Metro train line and oh so foggy! I paid $585 for a 5th floor studio in the Tenderloin for a year - the elevator never worked & there were people passed out on the building stairs every morning but it was walking distance to Union Square. I eventually settled in the Richmond district; all 1-bdrms for around $1200 to $1400 per month. It was nice to be near Clement Street, Golden Gate Park and the 'Dirty-8' Geary bus. My brother pays $600 for his room (apt shared with 3 other boys) in the Mission. If I were to move back to SF, I'd look to be near Hayes Valley but would probably end up back in the Richmond.
I've lived in SF for 15 years. Assuming you're on a low budget, try to get a place in the outer sunset, cheap and close to the N Muni line that can connect you to downtown easily. Once here you can decide which neighborhood to move to and look for good rental deals off season. Good luck in your move :)
I agree with tara: get a sublet and look for yourself. I also (somewhat) disagree with bepsf (which is rare...): it's totally possible to move here without a firm job offer, but have an exit strategy. When I moved here 7 years ago, I had $5k saved which was enough for rent and living expenses for about 3 months. I had no job and no friends but I was determined to make it work, and I knew that if it didn't, I'd just pack my car and move again to somewhere cheaper. I worked a few odd jobs while looking for something permanent and was on my feet within the first two months. It can be done.
I live in Cole Valley and love it. Studios are hard to come by but they do exist. There are some nice apartments just over the hill on the other side of UCSF the earlier Avenues 9th Ave being the last one for me..a little street called Hugo between 9th and 2nd Ave is a very nice little nook a bit less than Cole Valley right near the J Line and a block from Golden Gate Park.
I like the lower haight too closer to duboce park side.
SFview made a good suggestion about subleting a good way to figure out which neighborhood works best for you.
I was born and raised in San Francisco as well, and I have lived in/recommend the following neighborhoods if you are looking for a hip neighborhood with a lot of things to do in walking distance:
The Mission
Hayes Valley
Alamo Square
Duboce Triangle
Nob Hill
Russian Hill
TenderNob
I was also born and raised in San Francisco, in North Beach, and recently bought an Edwardian condo in "Middle" Haight area on Pierce near Duboce Park.
These are the neighborhoods where I looked while house-shopping:
- North Beach
- North of the Panhandle aka Western Addition
- Russian Hill
- Mission Dolores
- the Inner Richmond
- Cole Valley
- Alamo Square
- The Haight (Upper and Lower until Fillmore)
- Duboce Triangle.
I actually think the last has the best of everything: village-like feel with tree-lined streets, gorgeous Edwardian apartments, residential and quiet but smack dab in the middle of EVERYTHING (it's literally in the center of the city).
On another note I disagree that North Beach just automatically equals "college." There is one street, Grant, and maybe 2 other establishments nearby, that get a young crowd on the weekends, but I'm 28 and I am just as likely to go there as well.
Also IMO the Haight does not really equal hippies, unless you count the annoying gutterpunks whom I admit are a detractor. But have you seen housing costs there? I think it's more accurate to say Haight = tourists (which of course is true to a degree of the main drag of North Beach as well).
Miraloma Park. You can find parking in front of your house. Close to the freeways and your within 10 minutes of Downtown, Haight, Noe Valley, West Portal, Sunset, Bernal Heights etc. Even most Native San Franciscans do not know of this Neighborhood.
Oh man, i have to put in a plug for my neighborhood. We love love love bernal heights - has a nice chilled-out community feeling, it has a great main drag with good restaurants and shops, and it's within easy walking distance to the hip mission district and super quick access to the highways. it does have it's fair share of babies and dogs, but not as overwhelming as noe valley. prices vary enormously, start tracking craigs list when you get serious about moving.
...Not the Tenderloin.
Access to BART is key. For me. And, since I like to ride a bike, I fancy the flats. It's Mission District through and through for me. I'd opt for something closer to 24th St over 16th.
I've lived in SF for 4 years and I find that paying more and living in a safe neighborhood is worth it. I currently live in pacific heights and I love it. There isnt much of a night scene but theres tons of great shops and restaurants and just a 15 min bus ride downtown. I think for your first place you should be central, I would not suggest living in the outer/inner richmond and sunset unless you have a family and want a house with a garage.
OAKLAND!
I lived in the city for 11 years and lived in Noe Valley and the Inner Richmond. I have to say, I'm glad to be back in the East Bay where it's sunnier and less windy.
In my free time I found myself gravitating to the sunniest neighborhoods such as the Mission. The Inner Richmond gets fogged in but isn't as bad as Outer Richmond and Sunset, and it is the best combo of safe and affordable in the city along with the Sunset. The Richmond has more style and more trees than the Sunset IMO.
As far as fog, some consider Divisadero the dividing line with things getting progressively foggier as you move toward the Pacific.
Clement St. in the Richmond is really fun and still feels authentic and down to earth with the Asian grocery stores, etc.
You're near GG Park, the de Young and the Presidio in the Richmond if you like walking in parks.
Living in Noe was great because it's fairly sunny and 24th is a great walking and shopping street. It's definitely a dog and stroller neighborhood, and not very diverse, but the Mission is very close by.
I have lived in the bay area for about nine years now, including SF, Berkeley and Oakland. I agree with others who suggested subletting first. If you really know nothing about the various neighborhoods in the city then you will want to explore a little and figure out what suits you before committing to a lease. Each neighborhood has it's own vibe and character (sometimes *too* much character), and even more importantly, each has it's own weather!
I lived in the Inner Sunset, which I loved for a number of reasons (great food, laid back/small town feel, tons of muni lines, right next to GG park, easy access to Marin which is where I worked), but it is *quite* cold and foggy there, and if you have any tendency toward seasonal affect disorder I would not recommend it. This neighborhood also has strong working class roots, and even though it's gentrifying it definitely feels less posh than some other neighborhoods in the city. I'm a big fan of that, but if you're looking for a more upscale experience then you probably will want to look in the Northern parts of the city (Marina, Russian Hill, Nob Hill, etc).
I would think about what things are important to you in terms of weather, outdoor activities, nightlife, commute/transportation, etc. There are so many amazing and diverse neighborhoods in SF... I'm sure you'll find one you love, but you will just have to explore a bit first.
We've lived in SF for almost 6 yrs. now in the Marina, ugh. We manage our building and pay only half for the usual rent cost, which is lucky. Otherwise we'd live somewhere else! So it is important to know if you have a pet, a car, want to live somewhere quiet, non-foggy, sunny, lively, and what you want from the city. We like Russian Hill, The Richmond, Bernal Heights, Pacific Heights and other areas so it is helpful to spend some time in different areas at different times of the day too. The types of people really vary as to different areas of the city. Best of luck to you!
urbancricket: robin williams lives in Sea Cliff, not Pac Heights- in fact, no where near Pac heights.
I have to agree with revelry, Oakland or Berekely is where you should be looking. SF is great for well established families, or people who can afford it. The thing to consider is that some of the cheaper neighborhoods in SF are actually farther away, or as far as the east bay. I live in the Oakland hills, I take the casual carpool or BART to the city every morning, it takes about 20 minutes to get dropped right outside my building, 15-20 taking Bart. The east bay has great neighborhoods, trendy and hip berkeley, chill Oakland and tiny neighborhoods like montclaire and lakeshore. The rent is cheaper, the people are friendly, and there's a greater sense of community within neighborhoods. The other big difference is that though east bay people have everything they need on their side of the bay we actually go to SF, walnut creek, concord and other areas where people who live in SF tend to stay there and miss out on all of e greatthi gs the rest of the bay has to offer, just think about it :)
Have you visited SF/the Bay Area before? If not, you should in order to help make better sense of the comments/suggestions. It's important to do your research ahead of time, save $, etc, but you'll really get a better feel for a place if you visit and spend time here first. Good luck!
This is so timely! My hubs and I will be moving to SF in April and and trying to source as much as possible before the late-march apartment scramble trip.
I'll be splitting my time between Walnut Creek and the SF airport, and we'll be cutting back to one car, so Bart close be is necessary. We'll also be moving in based on my income only (100k+10k annual bonus) so our price ceiling is 2500 (could stretch to 3000, but prefer not to). Oh and we have two kitties.
Any suggestions would be fab... Location is primary, then awesomeness of apartment, then square footage.
PS we LOVE PAC heights, but it is just too far from Bart/airport... We are thinking lower nob/mission near 24th/Noe valley, but are open minded.